Upgraded steering rack - Zilvia.net Forums | Nissan 240SX (Silvia) and Z (Fairlady) Car Forum

cmathews · 05-06-2002, 12:22 AM

I was wondering if anyone knew of a steering rack swap that gave our 240's a tighter lock to lock. I think the stock lock to lock is 2.5 turns. I would love it if that could be taken down to 2.0 or maybe even 1.5. It wouldn't be safe to let friends or relatives drive the car anymore, but I don't really care about that.  It would give the car a more racecar type of feel and make it easier to autocross. Anyway, if anyone has any ideas, great, otherwise I will just lightly ponder in on my own. This isn't likely to be an immediate upgrade anyway.

chuck

Goodbar6 · 05-06-2002, 05:26 AM

I was pondering the same thing this whole week. That would make autocrossing one heckuva lot easier....hmmm maybe Nismo has something?
Tyler :!:

*DSC* · 05-06-2002, 09:51 AM

I believe the 300zx (90+) has a tighter steering rack but I'm not sure what all can be swaped into our car.  You could always just get new gears custom made *shrugs* would probably be more money than its worth though...not to mention hard to find someone willing to do it.

You could get an aftermarket wheel.  Though the turn radius would still be the same, you'd have to move your arms less since you'd have a smaller wheel.

tnord · 05-06-2002, 10:36 AM

would a smaller wheel effectively reduce lock to lock??

think of it in terms of angles and distances. lets say you need to move the wheel 20 degrees to make a particular turn. now, if you have a wheel with a radius of 250mm, the actual distance traveled would be larger than the distance traveled with a wheel that had a radius of 150mm. so this would work wouldn't it?? i was gonna make a little drawing in paint and put it up but i'm not sure how. anybody know??

draw two circles, with the small one inside the large one, using the same center point.  now draw two lines from the center point through the outside of the big circle to create an angle that is the same through both circles.  now look at the distance of the section of circle that is enclosed by the angle you just drew. the large circle has a longer section.  

so in conclusion, if a smaller turn of the wheel rotates the wheels the same amount, wouldn't the lock-to-lock be reduced as well??

btw....this is quite an interesting topic, i like it

mrdirty · 05-06-2002, 11:09 AM

to increase the steering sensitivity u could do 2 things:
-increase diameter of the pinion gear
-shorten the distance from the center of wheel rotation to
the tie-rod end. But this would mess up steering I think 'cause the system won't be a parrallelogram anymore so you would have a non-linear relationship between input and output.

cmathews · 05-06-2002, 11:14 AM

In response to the smaller wheel thing --- no it does not change the lock to lock. It does change the distance that your hands have to move (distance) but does not change the amount in degrees or radians in which the wheel turns. The smaller wheel may be the best way to go, as it would help to turn the car quicker, but I was acctually looking for a  way to reduce the lock to lock and radians from 5pi to 4pi or 3pi radians. This means that my goal has to do with angles rather than distances.

Chuck

cmathews · 05-06-2002, 11:17 AM

mrdirty, I think that you might be on to something with the pinion gear. I just don't know if it can be changed on a stock steering rack. As for the length of the tie rod, this would not change the distance thrown, only the tow in of the front tires.

Chuck

*AceInHole* · 05-06-2002, 12:28 PM

supposedly the S13 HICAS steering rack is "quicker", meaning more steering per wheel input.  I'm going to check it out the next chance I can get to head to the junkyard (already found a yard near me with a HICAS S13... friend got the LSD from it for $230).

tnord · 05-06-2002, 04:01 PM

in response to my own post, upon thinking about it further, the smaller wheel most definitely will not reduce lock-to-lock, while it does reduce hand motion....this is good......the reduced motion to create the appropriate steering angle should be directly proportional to the change in overall wheel circumference

so yeah.......cmathews is right........i like this new guy

05-06-2002, 12:22 AM	#1
cmathews Leaky Injector Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 61 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	I was wondering if anyone knew of a steering rack swap that gave our 240's a tighter lock to lock. I think the stock lock to lock is 2.5 turns. I would love it if that could be taken down to 2.0 or maybe even 1.5. It wouldn't be safe to let friends or relatives drive the car anymore, but I don't really care about that.  It would give the car a more racecar type of feel and make it easier to autocross. Anyway, if anyone has any ideas, great, otherwise I will just lightly ponder in on my own. This isn't likely to be an immediate upgrade anyway. chuck __________________ "It's not how you stand by your car, it's how you drive your car. You better learn that." Winning comes only after preparation. If you don't prepare so you can win then you are inadvertantly preparing to lose. Drive it like you stole it!

05-06-2002, 05:26 AM	#2
Goodbar6 Leaky Injector Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 148 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	I was pondering the same thing this whole week. That would make autocrossing one heckuva lot easier....hmmm maybe Nismo has something? Tyler :!: __________________ ___ 1990 Nissan Maxima (Daily Driver) 1989 Nissan 240SX (sold...kicking myself in the butt for it) Soon Another S13 for me to play with :-) --Tyler Loewens

05-06-2002, 09:51 AM	#3
DSC New Title Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: VA Posts: 3,454 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	I believe the 300zx (90+) has a tighter steering rack but I'm not sure what all can be swaped into our car.  You could always just get new gears custom made shrugs would probably be more money than its worth though...not to mention hard to find someone willing to do it. You could get an aftermarket wheel.  Though the turn radius would still be the same, you'd have to move your arms less since you'd have a smaller wheel. __________________

05-06-2002, 11:14 AM	#6
cmathews Leaky Injector Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 61 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	In response to the smaller wheel thing --- no it does not change the lock to lock. It does change the distance that your hands have to move (distance) but does not change the amount in degrees or radians in which the wheel turns. The smaller wheel may be the best way to go, as it would help to turn the car quicker, but I was acctually looking for a  way to reduce the lock to lock and radians from 5pi to 4pi or 3pi radians. This means that my goal has to do with angles rather than distances. Chuck __________________ "It's not how you stand by your car, it's how you drive your car. You better learn that." Winning comes only after preparation. If you don't prepare so you can win then you are inadvertantly preparing to lose. Drive it like you stole it!

05-06-2002, 11:17 AM	#7
cmathews Leaky Injector Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 61 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	mrdirty, I think that you might be on to something with the pinion gear. I just don't know if it can be changed on a stock steering rack. As for the length of the tie rod, this would not change the distance thrown, only the tow in of the front tires. Chuck __________________ "It's not how you stand by your car, it's how you drive your car. You better learn that." Winning comes only after preparation. If you don't prepare so you can win then you are inadvertantly preparing to lose. Drive it like you stole it!

05-06-2002, 10:36 AM	#4
tnord Nissanaholic! Join Date: Dec 2001 Posts: 1,975 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	would a smaller wheel effectively reduce lock to lock?? think of it in terms of angles and distances. lets say you need to move the wheel 20 degrees to make a particular turn. now, if you have a wheel with a radius of 250mm, the actual distance traveled would be larger than the distance traveled with a wheel that had a radius of 150mm. so this would work wouldn't it?? i was gonna make a little drawing in paint and put it up but i'm not sure how. anybody know?? draw two circles, with the small one inside the large one, using the same center point.  now draw two lines from the center point through the outside of the big circle to create an angle that is the same through both circles.  now look at the distance of the section of circle that is enclosed by the angle you just drew. the large circle has a longer section.   so in conclusion, if a smaller turn of the wheel rotates the wheels the same amount, wouldn't the lock-to-lock be reduced as well?? btw....this is quite an interesting topic, i like it

05-06-2002, 11:09 AM	#5
mrdirty Zilvia Addict Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Thunder Bay Ontario Age: 47 Posts: 650 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	to increase the steering sensitivity u could do 2 things: -increase diameter of the pinion gear -shorten the distance from the center of wheel rotation to the tie-rod end. But this would mess up steering I think 'cause the system won't be a parrallelogram anymore so you would have a non-linear relationship between input and output.

05-06-2002, 12:28 PM	#8
AceInHole Autox Technician Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: New Haven, CT Age: 44 Posts: 3,961 Trader Rating: (0) Rides Gallery: AceInHole Feedback Score: 0 reviews	supposedly the S13 HICAS steering rack is "quicker", meaning more steering per wheel input.  I'm going to check it out the next chance I can get to head to the junkyard (already found a yard near me with a HICAS S13... friend got the LSD from it for $230). __________________

05-06-2002, 04:01 PM	#9
tnord Nissanaholic! Join Date: Dec 2001 Posts: 1,975 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	in response to my own post, upon thinking about it further, the smaller wheel most definitely will not reduce lock-to-lock, while it does reduce hand motion....this is good......the reduced motion to create the appropriate steering angle should be directly proportional to the change in overall wheel circumference so yeah.......cmathews is right........i like this new guy