Timing Chain and Adjustments

[Powerzen2002]

Hey.  What are the signs of the Time'ing chain going?  Besides a rattle.  Is there any noticeable signs while driving?  Such as sluggish engine or what not.

Also, how would I check the timeing on my car.

[DuffMan]

As a timing chain gets loose, it would stretch out throwing off timing a bit, but that would be hard to notice.

The chance of timing chain actually failing is basically nihl if your tensioners are working, so assuming proper tension, no need to worry.

[hurleyboi514]

should i worry about mine?  its noisy as hell...

[Powerzen2002]

Ok.  Well heres the thing.  My engine feels like its slipping quite a bit.  Theres a HUGE rattle from the time'ing chain area.  Not to mention, that when im driving for long periods of time it tends to get a little better.  But when the car is cold, it feels like its definately slippin.

I have no clue what to do!  I mean, im hoping its just my chain!  Nothing else.  BUT the slipping feeling didnt start until recently when the chain rattle started.  Coincidence?

[Powerzen2002]

Heres another question to im curious about... these cars have both a timing belt and chain?  I have a '90 SOHC.

What the deal man.  I know the chain is right in front under the valve cover.  But where the hell is the belt?

[geeaj]

All KA motors have timing CHAINS. There are no timing belts.

[Powerzen2002]

Ok.  Kewl.  Question.  What are the SERIOUS signs the chain is gotta be replaced?

Would it show signs of really lagged drive, with the feeling of a slipping motor?  And the occassional tick from the timing chain area?  or is the tick the only signs and the other things are another problem?

thanks

[transient]

The general consensus is, if it's rattling a lot, you should bring it in to have it looked at. It's possible that it's just one of the guides, and you'll be in and out in a flash, but the KA is an interferance engine, meaning that if the chain goes, so does your valvetrain. It's worth it to have it looked at, and possibly save yourself the cost of a new engine (unless you want to swap <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=''>)

[Powerzen2002]

damn it! &nbsp;But if the chain is going... does it necessarily mean my valve train is following it on its way out also?

I know the chain is definately shot. &nbsp;Im bringing it in, the job is to big for me to do myself .. and not worth the trouble.

However, the car is running SHITTTTTTTTY ... like you wouldnt believe. &nbsp;I'm hoping it is just the chain. &nbsp;

Its a 90 with only 60K miles on like i said... was owned by a granny with no clue! &nbsp;<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=''> &nbsp;So i doubt the valve train is going so soon!

[SaintlyCharBoy]

i think what he meant is that if the chain actually fails the timing will get all f****d and the valves and pistons and other such yummy parts will munch each other to tiny bits and cause a generally shitty sound to eminate from your compartment

just because a chain is going doesn't mean that the valve train is bad

change the chain and you shouldn't have to worry

[DuffMan]

Yep, if the chain slips completely, there goes the valves and pistons. No more KA.

What exactly do you mean by slipping. Chains don't exactly slip. But a stretched out chain would through cam timing off, which would hurt performance.

Also, tensioner failure is a more common on the SOHC. I know people have actually lost motors due to timing chain failure with the SOHC, but with dual cam, It is extremely rare.

I think you should get it checked out. Either take it to the dealer, or a really experienced master tech, because this isn't something for the average mechanic to tackle.

[Powerzen2002]

duffman, i totally agree with you on that. &nbsp;this is definately beyond the average fixer-uper.

I mean, now today... it really was even worse. &nbsp;the car felt totally powerless, and to keep up in traffic was a bitch today! &nbsp;i dunno. &nbsp;this sounds more and more like a tentioner and bad chain combo now. &nbsp;i dunno since i really dont have much experience on this &nbsp;car.

thanks for all the input though.

[XxDriverxX]

Hey..

I have a DOHC (92 S13) with 222,000KM. &nbsp;The chain is starting to make ALOT of noise and I'm feeling delayed preformance.

Could it also be my tensioners? &nbsp;I hear on the DOHC, the chain itself is never a problem, only in the SOHC. &nbsp;How right is that statement?

Thanks

[camppain]

best way to tell take your valve cover off and see how much play/slack is in your chain side to side. i replaced mine on my sohc and helped another guy do his by sending him the fsm pages.

if you have a dohc the first thing to go is the upper guide. second would be upper timing chain and thrird ould be lower t chain

all ka's are notorious for this altimas, frontiers and 240's

the only belts on a ka are drive belts. powers steering, a/c, fan, and alternator

[S13Grl]

If I were you, I would test the compression on this thing to ensure that the chain hasn't slipped already.

Also look for other problems. If your car is slipping, it could also be a clutch problem. Are your ignition wires really old? That causes a slipping kind of feeling to acceleration.

[blink0r]

The timing chain belt covers may have broken and that can cause a loud rattling noise.

Also, the lifters have been known to rattle in 240's.

[Powerzen2002]

How could a bad timing chain cause you to lose compression?

Also, I am dropping off my car tomorrow morning to do the timing chain. &nbsp;I dont think anyone that has less than a few years in the shop should even bother attempting this. &nbsp;

Anyway, I tried to attempt this... and took me a couple of hours to just get the pulleys and belts off!

Hopefully this wont run more than 300 bucks tomorrow. &nbsp;Also, does anyone know if the rockers in the engine have tendancy to go lose? &nbsp;Or need adjusting? &nbsp;thanks.

[Powerzen2002]

DAAAMMMNNN... &nbsp;I dunno. &nbsp;But i envy you people that change the chains on these things. &nbsp;JUST dropped off the car at my friends shop. &nbsp;He used his software to do an estimate for me. &nbsp;According to "shop prices" the replacement in man hours is about 10 hours. &nbsp;

He priced it at about 800 - 1000 dollars! &nbsp;THIS REALLY FUKIN sux! &nbsp;This is a 90 with ONLY 60K miles! &nbsp;What the hell! &nbsp;That is practically the cost of a new stock motor! &nbsp;BUULLLLSHIT!

OH WELL. &nbsp;aint gonna be able to do it myself, if it takes a trained mechanic a day and a half to do it!

[Powerzen2002]

Hey, Ok. I found out its really my CHAIN guide, not my chain that is all screwed up. Does any one know a rough amount of time before this chain guide is all eaten away?

Also, once the chain guide is mostly eaten away, will the chain just simply come off the track?

Thanks.

[Powerzen2002]

If its 800 to replace the timing chain guide, is it really worth it? &nbsp;If the guide gets fully eaten away what will happen? Will the chain just come off the track immediately?

[adey]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Powerzen2002 @ May 08 2002,2:58)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Hey, Ok. I found out its really my CHAIN guide, not my chain that is all screwed up. Does any one know a rough amount of time before this chain guide is all eaten away?</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
errr... okay....
as I (think most of us) suspected, it wasn't the chain after all. The Chain guide is not going to get "eaten away", and is, if I recall, quite useless in our cars. That is to say, don't worry about it. Don't bother replacing it if it's going to cost that much.
I feel a nudge in the faq direction is required. <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/dozingoff.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=''> There's no need for so much drama!
Unless the tensioners are shot, the chain will not come right off the track -- unless the SOHCs are substantially different from their DOHC counterparts.

edit: someone teach this guy how to use the EDIT button...
edit: the chain guide should have no affect on performance, so your hypothesis of something "slipping" is off... unless you've checked the clutch and it's the problem.

[DuffMan]

I'm not sure exactly how it works on a SOHC, but 10 hours is for replacing the entire timing chain assembly, just the guide should be cheaper. Might require removal of the timing &nbsp;cover, but that should only take a couple hours max.

[Powerzen2002]

The whole thing is the guide is behind the timing chain assembly, so either way it has to be removed. &nbsp;

If what you guys is saying is the chain wont slipped or pop off by missing a few teeth &nbsp;because the guide is missing or messed up, then i wont bother with it for now.

Thanks

[NutzDrifta]

If I were you, I would change that part as soon as possible. &nbsp;If the tensioner goes, so does your whole engine. &nbsp;It is cheaper to get the chain guide replaced instead of rebuilding your engine. &nbsp;With all the info you have supplied, sounds like it is ready to go. &nbsp;Well, that's just my opinion.