Wiring help please! - Zilvia.net Forums | Nissan 240SX (Silvia) and Z (Fairlady) Car Forum

RSP13-Sideways · 04-23-2006, 05:27 PM

I have an '89 Nissan 240SX w/ 1996 Blacktop RPS13 swap and a S13 Silvia Tri-Projector front end

The wiring was professionally done by Danny Young here in California and he left all my stock plugs (ka24d) on the car incase I planned on swapping back. The SR20DET is back in with a new Intake Manifold/turbo/fuel system and I'm having trouble getting it to turn on.

The car won't even flash the hazards, the battery is fully charged and relocated to the trunk, but the car isn't getting any kind of power. So I believe it has to do with some plugs in the engine that aren't connected right now. There are three sets that I'm confused about...

1st Set: This is what the plugs look like and I think they go to the transmission, not sure though.

This is where they are located on the main engine harness. They go into this area of wiring and they are pretty long which leads me to believe they go underneath to the tranny but I could be mistakened.

2nd Set: These branch off the fuse box, I have a S13 Tri-Projector front end so are these plugs for the pop ups which I don't have anymore? I don't remember these going to anywhere, here's the picture.

3rd Set: These two plugs (ones black and ones grey in the picture) come off the main harness before the ignitor. Where do these go?

Thanks for all the help, I'm a bit stumped is all....

g6civcx · 04-23-2006, 09:24 PM

1. Should be your gearbox sensors but I can't tell from the pix. All the connectors look the same. If they run off the engine harness then yes that's where they go.

2. You need the #1 and #2 retractor relay, unless you want to bypass them completely and solder the wires together. For now make sure all your retractor relays are back in. Let's get your car started first. Search for threads I posted in about Silvia foglight wiring and we'll get into that later on.

There should be matching plugs for those 2 connectors at the battery terminal.

3. You don't need them. Tape them up and tuck them away.

95zilvia · 04-23-2006, 10:14 PM

Yeah the plugs on picture set #2 go into your stock battery terminal. I think those are important!

RSP13-Sideways · 04-23-2006, 10:18 PM

the problem is with picture Picture Set:2 is that I relocated the battery to the rear of the car! When I relocated it to the back of the car it ran fine, now that I did this, there is no power.

I agree, lets get the car started first, where the hell does Picture Set#2 wiring go, I cannot seem to find plugs that look like that around the fuse box area...

g6civcx · 04-24-2006, 07:07 AM

They should have a plug at the battery terminal like this.

drifter808 · 04-24-2006, 10:27 AM

yeah those need to be connected, i had the same problem when they were unhooked. car wouldn't start at all. Does your battery positive wire meet at a junction box in the engine bay? Cause you could just wire them in right there.

g6civcx · 04-24-2006, 12:17 PM

Just remember that when you lengthen a wire, you increase resistance. So it's better to increase gauge size (smaller numerical value) to prevent overheating.

rican_nick · 04-24-2006, 10:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by g6civcx

They should have a plug at the battery terminal like this.

exactly.. these power the main fuse box i belive which include many accessories. check your engine bay for the stock power wire.. put in a junction box.. plug these in.. and you should be good to go.

RSP13-Sideways · 04-24-2006, 10:21 PM

I pluged in the plug that you were talking about. Car fired right now but it's cranking, it's not starting though.

1. Car is getting spark, I checked the spark plug and it arched on the shock tower.

2. Car is getting fuel (maybe too much?) I'm running an HKS topfeed fuel rail with 750cc injectors and an HKS FPR. The FPR was set at 60psi (Too much for startup) and the car continued to crank. I set it at 20psi should I go lower? When I unplug the injectors the car backfires out of the intake manifold, is this normal? I think it's clearing the fuel since it was so flooded in there!

Quick question, I wired the injectors myself, I checked the ground and it's grounded when cranking and the power is constant. Is there a preference between negative and positive wires? I don't think so right?

Let me know the answers to these questions and the SR might be running by tonight! Thanks!

drifter808 · 04-24-2006, 11:23 PM

injectors will work either way.

RSP13-Sideways · 04-24-2006, 11:51 PM

Ok so I'm calling it a night. The car just seems like it's running WAY to freakin' rich. The injectors are topfeed RC 750cc's. I turned the FPR down to about 15psi and it still seems like it's flooding.

I got the headgasket done at a shop and I'm not sure if they screwed up the timing, or if the cams are flipped 180. I screwed around with the CAS and it seemed like it wanted to start a couple of times and then just backfired loud like a damn gunshot. How do I check to see if the cams are flipped 180? The mechanic is not going to remember, it's been like 4-months since the headgasket was installed.

g6civcx · 04-25-2006, 12:33 PM

In order to start, you obviously need fuel, spark on all 4 cylinders, and good compression and timing.

I would make sure all the injectors are pulsing and you have good fuel pressure. Then check sparks on all 4 coilpacks. Then you can start looking into timing and compression.

RSP13-Sideways · 04-25-2006, 12:40 PM

-Checked all four injectors, all have constant power and ground upon crank.

-Checked the fuel and I'm definitely getting fuel, the FPR was reading 60, turned it down to 15 because I think it's flooding the hell out of the system during cranking.

-Checked the 1st coilpack and the sparkplug was arching, so I'm definitely getting spark.

I think the cams are flipped 180 but I doubt it since the mechanic is extremely well known for working SRs, but I'll check this when I get home otherwise do you think it could be the ECU? The ECU is tuned for this specific setup with the Z32 MAF, should I check what codes it's throwing if any?

I'm stumped, but the backfire is coming out of the intake manifold which is why I think the cams are 180'd. If not why the hell is it backfiring out of the intake manifold? I screwed with the CAS and it seemed like the car wanted to start but my buddy was just moving it back and forth. Let me know G6CIV, YOURE MY ONLY HOPE!

g6civcx · 04-25-2006, 01:25 PM

At this point you'll need somebody to see it in person. Check the wiring as best you can. Sometimes faulty wiring will prevent the motor from starting.

ledzeppelin240 · 04-25-2006, 02:22 PM

The cam timing being out or the ignition timing being out will cause it to backfire. Screwing around with the CAS might have caused you more problems now...

RSP13-Sideways · 04-25-2006, 04:38 PM

ledzeppelin240: I marked the CAS exactly where it should be, I know where to put it back.

I found out what the problem is, I'm running 750cc HI-RESISTANCE injectors, they need to be LO-RESISTANCE 750cc injectors. I need resistors for them, but where the hell do I get them at. RC Engineering is saying they don't carry them and to get from a vendor...Radio Shack maybe? Which ones though? Search is coming up blank here..
.

g6civcx · 04-25-2006, 05:09 PM

High resistance = saturated fuel injectors (OEM style). Low resistance = peak and hold injectors.

Peak and hold injectors need a resistor box. Saturated does not need a resistor box and works straight off of the ECU signal.

It is not as simple as slapping resistors together (not that it would work for your problem any way). You need to get the correct fuel injectors for your setup.

RSP13-Sideways · 04-25-2006, 10:51 PM

So what you're saying G6 is that I need to purchase the Low resistance injectors and get rid of these high resistance ones? I was under the impression according to RC Engineering that their resistors would work if attached to the high resistance injectors creating a lower resistance thus making them flow less?

g6civcx · 04-26-2006, 06:36 AM

Okay, check it out. Fuel injectors come in 2 types, as I said above. You can't just pick whichever type you want even though they will bolt into the fuel rail. You have to match it to the ECU. The stock ECU can only generate signals for the saturated type. This type is slower, but requires less complexity and reduces cost.

Yes, you can run peak-hold types on the stock ECU with a resistor box, but the response time is actually lower than the stock saturated type because the propagation delay slows it down. Plus you have to deal with the resistor box. The only good way to run peak-hold is with an ECU/piggyback/standalone that's designed to generate these control signals.

Since you already bought saturated, which are HIGH resistance, adding resistors in series will only bring the resistance HIGHER, which defeats the purpose. I think you got your facts or terminology backward. You can use low-resistance peak-hold on your stock ECU meant for saturated types by adding resistors, but it will be slower and more expensive. So why bother?

You CANNOT use saturated injectors on an ECU meant for peak-hold types unless you ditched the resistor box, which defeats the purpose of having the ECU tuned this way.

What ECU are you running by the way?

RSP13-Sideways · 04-26-2006, 09:01 AM

That's what I was about to say, I'm running an Enthalpy tuned ECU for the -

GT2871R
Z32 MAF
750cc Topfeed Injectors

The ECU signal for the injectors is not stock obviously, what do you suggest.

airlu · 04-27-2006, 05:13 PM

Quick question...there are two wire, one black and one brown by the starter wires, do any one know what they are for? My car ran, but, suddenly does not start or turn over at all. I notice those two wires are not connect to anything, and I do not remember if they connect to anything or not. Is it possible that my starter is broken? I have pics that I can send if anyone can help. Thanks in advance.

04-23-2006, 10:18 PM	#4
RSP13-Sideways Zilvia Addict Join Date: May 2003 Location: Northern California Age: 42 Posts: 850 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	the problem is with picture Picture Set:2 is that I relocated the battery to the rear of the car! When I relocated it to the back of the car it ran fine, now that I did this, there is no power. I agree, lets get the car started first, where the hell does Picture Set#2 wiring go, I cannot seem to find plugs that look like that around the fuse box area... __________________ - Jay WTB: Nothing at the moment. LEWL WTS: Everything sold, thanks folks!

04-24-2006, 10:27 AM	#6
drifter808 Zilvia Addict Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Big Island Age: 36 Posts: 829 Trader Rating: (4) Rides Gallery: drifter808 Feedback Score: 4 reviews	yeah those need to be connected, i had the same problem when they were unhooked. car wouldn't start at all. Does your battery positive wire meet at a junction box in the engine bay? Cause you could just wire them in right there. __________________

04-24-2006, 10:21 PM	#9
RSP13-Sideways Zilvia Addict Join Date: May 2003 Location: Northern California Age: 42 Posts: 850 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	I pluged in the plug that you were talking about. Car fired right now but it's cranking, it's not starting though. 1. Car is getting spark, I checked the spark plug and it arched on the shock tower. 2. Car is getting fuel (maybe too much?) I'm running an HKS topfeed fuel rail with 750cc injectors and an HKS FPR. The FPR was set at 60psi (Too much for startup) and the car continued to crank. I set it at 20psi should I go lower? When I unplug the injectors the car backfires out of the intake manifold, is this normal? I think it's clearing the fuel since it was so flooded in there! Quick question, I wired the injectors myself, I checked the ground and it's grounded when cranking and the power is constant. Is there a preference between negative and positive wires? I don't think so right? Let me know the answers to these questions and the SR might be running by tonight! Thanks! __________________ - Jay WTB: Nothing at the moment. LEWL WTS: Everything sold, thanks folks!

04-24-2006, 11:23 PM	#10
drifter808 Zilvia Addict Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Big Island Age: 36 Posts: 829 Trader Rating: (4) Rides Gallery: drifter808 Feedback Score: 4 reviews	injectors will work either way. __________________

04-24-2006, 11:51 PM	#11
RSP13-Sideways Zilvia Addict Join Date: May 2003 Location: Northern California Age: 42 Posts: 850 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	Ok so I'm calling it a night. The car just seems like it's running WAY to freakin' rich. The injectors are topfeed RC 750cc's. I turned the FPR down to about 15psi and it still seems like it's flooding. I got the headgasket done at a shop and I'm not sure if they screwed up the timing, or if the cams are flipped 180. I screwed around with the CAS and it seemed like it wanted to start a couple of times and then just backfired loud like a damn gunshot. How do I check to see if the cams are flipped 180? The mechanic is not going to remember, it's been like 4-months since the headgasket was installed. __________________ - Jay WTB: Nothing at the moment. LEWL WTS: Everything sold, thanks folks!

04-23-2006, 05:27 PM	#1
RSP13-Sideways Zilvia Addict Join Date: May 2003 Location: Northern California Age: 42 Posts: 850 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	Wiring help please! I have an '89 Nissan 240SX w/ 1996 Blacktop RPS13 swap and a S13 Silvia Tri-Projector front end The wiring was professionally done by Danny Young here in California and he left all my stock plugs (ka24d) on the car incase I planned on swapping back. The SR20DET is back in with a new Intake Manifold/turbo/fuel system and I'm having trouble getting it to turn on. The car won't even flash the hazards, the battery is fully charged and relocated to the trunk, but the car isn't getting any kind of power. So I believe it has to do with some plugs in the engine that aren't connected right now. There are three sets that I'm confused about... 1st Set: This is what the plugs look like and I think they go to the transmission, not sure though. This is where they are located on the main engine harness. They go into this area of wiring and they are pretty long which leads me to believe they go underneath to the tranny but I could be mistakened. 2nd Set: These branch off the fuse box, I have a S13 Tri-Projector front end so are these plugs for the pop ups which I don't have anymore? I don't remember these going to anywhere, here's the picture. 3rd Set: These two plugs (ones black and ones grey in the picture) come off the main harness before the ignitor. Where do these go? Thanks for all the help, I'm a bit stumped is all.... __________________ - Jay WTB: Nothing at the moment. LEWL WTS: Everything sold, thanks folks!

04-23-2006, 09:24 PM	#2
g6civcx Post Whore! Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Virginia, USA Posts: 5,764 Trader Rating: (5) Feedback Score: 5 reviews	1. Should be your gearbox sensors but I can't tell from the pix. All the connectors look the same. If they run off the engine harness then yes that's where they go. 2. You need the #1 and #2 retractor relay, unless you want to bypass them completely and solder the wires together. For now make sure all your retractor relays are back in. Let's get your car started first. Search for threads I posted in about Silvia foglight wiring and we'll get into that later on. There should be matching plugs for those 2 connectors at the battery terminal. 3. You don't need them. Tape them up and tuck them away.

04-23-2006, 10:14 PM	#3
95zilvia Nissanaholic! Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: South San Francisco Age: 40 Posts: 1,860 Trader Rating: (0) Rides Gallery: 95zilvia Feedback Score: 0 reviews	Yeah the plugs on picture set #2 go into your stock battery terminal. I think those are important!

04-24-2006, 07:07 AM	#5
g6civcx Post Whore! Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Virginia, USA Posts: 5,764 Trader Rating: (5) Feedback Score: 5 reviews	They should have a plug at the battery terminal like this.

04-24-2006, 12:17 PM	#7
g6civcx Post Whore! Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Virginia, USA Posts: 5,764 Trader Rating: (5) Feedback Score: 5 reviews	Just remember that when you lengthen a wire, you increase resistance. So it's better to increase gauge size (smaller numerical value) to prevent overheating.

04-25-2006, 12:33 PM	#12
g6civcx Post Whore! Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Virginia, USA Posts: 5,764 Trader Rating: (5) Feedback Score: 5 reviews	In order to start, you obviously need fuel, spark on all 4 cylinders, and good compression and timing. I would make sure all the injectors are pulsing and you have good fuel pressure. Then check sparks on all 4 coilpacks. Then you can start looking into timing and compression.

04-25-2006, 12:40 PM	#13
RSP13-Sideways Zilvia Addict Join Date: May 2003 Location: Northern California Age: 42 Posts: 850 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	-Checked all four injectors, all have constant power and ground upon crank. -Checked the fuel and I'm definitely getting fuel, the FPR was reading 60, turned it down to 15 because I think it's flooding the hell out of the system during cranking. -Checked the 1st coilpack and the sparkplug was arching, so I'm definitely getting spark. I think the cams are flipped 180 but I doubt it since the mechanic is extremely well known for working SRs, but I'll check this when I get home otherwise do you think it could be the ECU? The ECU is tuned for this specific setup with the Z32 MAF, should I check what codes it's throwing if any? I'm stumped, but the backfire is coming out of the intake manifold which is why I think the cams are 180'd. If not why the hell is it backfiring out of the intake manifold? I screwed with the CAS and it seemed like the car wanted to start but my buddy was just moving it back and forth. Let me know G6CIV, YOURE MY ONLY HOPE! __________________ - Jay WTB: Nothing at the moment. LEWL WTS: Everything sold, thanks folks!

04-25-2006, 01:25 PM	#14
g6civcx Post Whore! Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Virginia, USA Posts: 5,764 Trader Rating: (5) Feedback Score: 5 reviews	At this point you'll need somebody to see it in person. Check the wiring as best you can. Sometimes faulty wiring will prevent the motor from starting.

04-25-2006, 02:22 PM	#15
ledzeppelin240 Zilvia Addict Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Sinse Posts: 688 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	The cam timing being out or the ignition timing being out will cause it to backfire. Screwing around with the CAS might have caused you more problems now... __________________ Anyway, no drug, not even alcohol, causes the fundamental ills of society. If we're looking for the source of our troubles, we shouldn't test people for drugs, we should test them for stupidity, ignorance, greed and love of power. Looking for: JDM S13 OEM Sideskirts

04-25-2006, 04:38 PM	#16
RSP13-Sideways Zilvia Addict Join Date: May 2003 Location: Northern California Age: 42 Posts: 850 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	ledzeppelin240: I marked the CAS exactly where it should be, I know where to put it back. I found out what the problem is, I'm running 750cc HI-RESISTANCE injectors, they need to be LO-RESISTANCE 750cc injectors. I need resistors for them, but where the hell do I get them at. RC Engineering is saying they don't carry them and to get from a vendor...Radio Shack maybe? Which ones though? Search is coming up blank here.. . __________________ - Jay WTB: Nothing at the moment. LEWL WTS: Everything sold, thanks folks!

04-25-2006, 05:09 PM	#17
g6civcx Post Whore! Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Virginia, USA Posts: 5,764 Trader Rating: (5) Feedback Score: 5 reviews	High resistance = saturated fuel injectors (OEM style). Low resistance = peak and hold injectors. Peak and hold injectors need a resistor box. Saturated does not need a resistor box and works straight off of the ECU signal. It is not as simple as slapping resistors together (not that it would work for your problem any way). You need to get the correct fuel injectors for your setup.

04-25-2006, 10:51 PM	#18
RSP13-Sideways Zilvia Addict Join Date: May 2003 Location: Northern California Age: 42 Posts: 850 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	So what you're saying G6 is that I need to purchase the Low resistance injectors and get rid of these high resistance ones? I was under the impression according to RC Engineering that their resistors would work if attached to the high resistance injectors creating a lower resistance thus making them flow less? __________________ - Jay WTB: Nothing at the moment. LEWL WTS: Everything sold, thanks folks!

04-26-2006, 06:36 AM	#19
g6civcx Post Whore! Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Virginia, USA Posts: 5,764 Trader Rating: (5) Feedback Score: 5 reviews	Okay, check it out. Fuel injectors come in 2 types, as I said above. You can't just pick whichever type you want even though they will bolt into the fuel rail. You have to match it to the ECU. The stock ECU can only generate signals for the saturated type. This type is slower, but requires less complexity and reduces cost. Yes, you can run peak-hold types on the stock ECU with a resistor box, but the response time is actually lower than the stock saturated type because the propagation delay slows it down. Plus you have to deal with the resistor box. The only good way to run peak-hold is with an ECU/piggyback/standalone that's designed to generate these control signals. Since you already bought saturated, which are HIGH resistance, adding resistors in series will only bring the resistance HIGHER, which defeats the purpose. I think you got your facts or terminology backward. You can use low-resistance peak-hold on your stock ECU meant for saturated types by adding resistors, but it will be slower and more expensive. So why bother? You CANNOT use saturated injectors on an ECU meant for peak-hold types unless you ditched the resistor box, which defeats the purpose of having the ECU tuned this way. What ECU are you running by the way?

04-26-2006, 09:01 AM	#20
RSP13-Sideways Zilvia Addict Join Date: May 2003 Location: Northern California Age: 42 Posts: 850 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	That's what I was about to say, I'm running an Enthalpy tuned ECU for the - GT2871R Z32 MAF 750cc Topfeed Injectors The ECU signal for the injectors is not stock obviously, what do you suggest. __________________ - Jay WTB: Nothing at the moment. LEWL WTS: Everything sold, thanks folks!

04-27-2006, 05:13 PM	#21
airlu Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: NJ Posts: 6 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	Quick question...there are two wire, one black and one brown by the starter wires, do any one know what they are for? My car ran, but, suddenly does not start or turn over at all. I notice those two wires are not connect to anything, and I do not remember if they connect to anything or not. Is it possible that my starter is broken? I have pics that I can send if anyone can help. Thanks in advance.