BLOWN head g a s k e t!!!!

[Markovich]

ok dont tell me to search i did for 20 mins and got mad because its not in here. surprised knowone ever asked.
90 240sx redtop sr20det v-mount.
is there anything wrong with buying a stock hg? im as of now on a tight budget and cankt spend to much money and i blew my hg i was also wondering how hard the hg job is. like how hard and could anyone give me specs on the proper tourqe of the head and everything because i cant find any fsm in english thank you a lot and dont tell me to search because i did. what else should i replace/look for when i have the head off? estamaited time would be ice to thanks


peace

[Annoying Eric]

V-mount dont mean shit.. Are you running a stock turbo? Whats the boost at? Does it overheat alot?


If i were you i'd suck it up.. And buy a cometic, ive been in your situation and going the cheap route rarely works out..

[kensreliableb18b]

nothings wrong with an oem hg. changing the hg is pretty straightforward, but are you familiar with taking out the cams and resetting timing?

the job'll be a lot easier if the motors out of the car.

[johngriff]

mmm, not much different in or out of the car.

Lets see. A list of quality.

1: Apex-i (good luck getting one)
2: Power Enterprises (similar construction)
The rest? All crap.
HKS is "ok".. stay away from the greddy. Cometic? lol, if you dont mind changing it again, then yeah, go cometic.. its cheap right??!!? Cometic is > Greddy.

Ok, head studs. There are all kinds of weird issues going on with the ARP head studs, so Either the Greddy head studs or BRAND NEW STOCK JDM HEAD STUDS.

Do you have a machine shop local? If you dont this whole job will have been for nothing btw.

Good luck!

John

[HalveBlue]

As far as the complexity of changing the headgasket is concerned it's not that hard.

It's just a very involved process because you have to remove some many parts to get to it. If you've never done it before, it may take a while.

Also, if you're like me and like to torque things down to factory spec you'll obviously need to get a hold of a Factory Service Manual.

In fact, get one anyway, because it'll walk you through the process step by step.

Oh, and as long as you aren't generating crazy amounts of boost a stock head gasket will work fine.

For what it's worth I just changed my hg a few weeks ago. I replaced the stocker with a Cometic gasket and changed over to ARP headstuds. Honestly, I haven't had a problem so far, but I guess it's a little early to tell.

One last thing, take the engine out if you can. It might take a little bit of extra time but it's saves you a lot of frustration and downright anger that's generated when you work in tight, restricted spaces. Plus it allows you to better inspect the engine to see if anything else is going on.

Obviously, once the engine is out, replace/install anything that's hard to do with the engine in.

Oh yeah, don't drop anything, like say, a head bolt washer, down the timing chain area. Just don't...

[Wei240]

stock hg can withstand quite a bit from what i've been reading, and it's cheap, someone in the fs section has one on sale for 40 bucks...

[Annoying Eric]

Originally Posted by johngriff

mmm, not much different in or out of the car.

Lets see. A list of quality.

1: Apex-i (good luck getting one)
2: Power Enterprises (similar construction)
The rest? All crap.
HKS is "ok".. stay away from the greddy. Cometic? lol, if you dont mind changing it again, then yeah, go cometic.. its cheap right??!!? Cometic is > Greddy.

Ok, head studs. There are all kinds of weird issues going on with the ARP head studs, so Either the Greddy head studs or BRAND NEW STOCK JDM HEAD STUDS.

Do you have a machine shop local? If you dont this whole job will have been for nothing btw.

Good luck!

John

I hope your kidding, Cometic is one of the best headgaskets on the market. Not only for cars but also for high powered motorcycles. And i have built numerous engines using arp headstuds, I've never had any issues. lol.. You must be some noob that learnt how to build an engine by watching the speed channel.. please step aside and let the professionals take care of it...

[kensreliableb18b]

Originally Posted by johngriff

mmm, not much different in or out of the car.

Lets see. A list of quality.

1: Apex-i (good luck getting one)
2: Power Enterprises (similar construction)
The rest? All crap.
HKS is "ok".. stay away from the greddy. Cometic? lol, if you dont mind changing it again, then yeah, go cometic.. its cheap right??!!? Cometic is > Greddy.

Ok, head studs. There are all kinds of weird issues going on with the ARP head studs, so Either the Greddy head studs or BRAND NEW STOCK JDM HEAD STUDS.

Do you have a machine shop local? If you dont this whole job will have been for nothing btw.

Good luck!

John

for people reading this, theres nothing wrong with greddy hg's. mind you, i agree that apexi/pe hgs are preferable over greddy but still, nothing wrong with greddy hg's. dont know what problems you had but either they're isolated incidents and you're unlucky or there was an error in installation.

[Wei240]

i kinda skimmed thru freshalloy, but i believe some of the more senior members/tuners (people who knows their sh!t) had beef against greddy hg...

but i gotta re-read it again...

yes, this is purely based on internet reading, take it as you may,

apex > cometic > greddy

stock is stock, it's not metal, but it's proven to be good enough for most

[Gramentz]

Cometic for the win!!

[S14DB]

Cometic only sucks if you don't know what you are doing. Same with ARP. If you are having problems then you probably did something wrong.

[johngriff]

Heh guys,

wow this thread is on fire.

The cometic lacks the flat surface fire ring that the apexi and P/E gasket has. Even the just launched cometic only has a small o-ring type that sits between the metal layers. But it does come pre-siliconed (so do the other higher quality gaskets)

Oh yeah! the biggest thing that bugged me personally about the commetic was that most of the gaskets sold were 88.5mm (full 2mm over oem bore). Alot of people are of the opinion that this gap is ok. I am not a believer in this, and to back up my point, cometic has started selling a 86.5mm gasket for the rwd SR.

You CAN get the right studs from ARP, but:

The kit they were selling for the SR (ie B18A LS Integra) were too short.
The newly revised SR kit they sell is still too short. You can order the correct sizing from arp, they are just a little more expensive. (custom order).
We have had the best luck using new OEM studs, or the greddy kit.

We went through this H/G nightmare and showdown about a month ago on F/A, when we lost a cometic relatively early on. I will tell steve to get on here and link you guys.

In the end on our drag car, we ordered a 86.5mm cometic and a Apexi gasket, the cometic showed up ALOT earlier than the Apexi so we put that on first. We were going to do a showdown between the two, but lost the bottom end (knock) right after we fired it up... so tear down build up, and we have the apexi shelved before this goes back together.

Ive said my part, and in alot of ways this is my opinion. In the instance you are running a stock t25 and just looking to keep the vehicle maintained, then cometic/greddy off the shelf arp really shouldnt be a problem. This is only based of my own PERSONAL experience in try to make things go sub 11 and go boom :0

[steve shadows]

hey guys I actually started a thread on another forumt o address these said issues regarding the ARP studs and the cometic and the issues had with them at competitive horsepower levels.


http://forums2.freshalloy.com/showthread.php?t=153517

[Wei240]

couldn't you use vw arp studs, usually in stock and a little bit cheaper, and i think it was longer?
i know i read it somewhere... just gotta look for it again

[kensreliableb18b]

yes, vw not b18a arp studs are commonly used with sr.

[steve shadows]

Originally Posted by Annoying Eric

I hope your kidding, Cometic is one of the best headgaskets on the market. Not only for cars but also for high powered motorcycles. And i have built numerous engines using arp headstuds, I've never had any issues. lol.. You must be some noob that learnt how to build an engine by watching the speed channel.. please step aside and let the professionals take care of it...

dude your out of you mind, they are the lowest priced, cheapest made, least effort into them in design option. Your trying to compare a small displacement motorcycle engine that is NA to a high boost application possibly high hp/liter 4 cyl turbo engine?

go read the FA link.

[steve shadows]

before annoying eric digs his grave on here any deeper let me post some pictures of the best possible design for high pressure turbo motor for best deck seal for metal headgasket ie power enterprises/apex-i design...

As you can see (if you compare to a cometic) there a thick metal grommet style fire ring (like o-ring) that encircles the entire cylinder where it mates the head and block int he quench chamber (valley) zone. If the bore size of your head gasket (commonly cometic only offers universal 88mm bore size) is too big you get a head soak in the quench valley and over time the super heating of this crevease in the seal will wear out the crappy but functional indentation type ring on the cometic...





for a stock turbo or below 350whp levels im sure the cometic will work if torqued properly and installed cleanly with the block decked and head resurfaced to specs. Over this level I have had nothing but negatiev feedback and issues from people all over the country including Mazaorks which recently ran a 9.22 with a sub 1000 hp level 2000cc sr20det motor in their s14. Mark himself said they runs STOCK toyota headgaskets on their 1000+hp supras before they will every use a cometic, read it for yourself.:hammer:

If you have any more questions ill be happy to answer.

I have since swithced to apexi/tomei/power enterprises design HG and we shall see how it holds up with 26 psi feeding out of gt35r compressor hopefully by oct for me...

[steve shadows]

Originally Posted by Wei240

stock hg can withstand quite a bit from what i've been reading, and it's cheap, someone in the fs section has one on sale for 40 bucks...

ive pushed over 20-30 psi of boost over a one year period (back on 03) thru a 62-1 on a completley stock oem redtop long block straight from a clip.

The stocker is abetter option than a metal hg for replacement under 350whp levels imo. why bother? If your not going to take the time a properly prepare the block deck surface your just wasting your time and gambling your labor hours.

I know this from good and bad experience alike.

[nismo200sx16]

here is my cometic after 4k miles of 20 psi

[Markovich]

this is a t25 how much boost can you turn it up to with the stock headgasket i know 14psi is the limits og the turbo but how close could i get there with a t25 and 255 lph fuel pump? jw and do i need to upgrade/stock head bolts?
thnx for all this
peace

[statik]

Originally Posted by Markovich

this is a t25 how much boost can you turn it up to with the stock headgasket i know 14psi is the limits og the turbo but how close could i get there with a t25 and 255 lph fuel pump? jw and do i need to upgrade/stock head bolts?
thnx for all this
peace

the most you will make with the T25 is ~250whp(14-15psi with supporting mods), which is no problem for the stock hg/bolts, usually people start having issues with >350whp.

[johngriff]

Ok.

If you plan on staying with the Stock Turbo then yeah, brand new OEM Head Gasket and Head studs sound awesome. We have gotten some suprisingly good performance out of "container engines". But with that being said, you blew the head gasket on the stock turbo?

Now, if we can run a 60trim etc at higher boost on a container engine, you should have no issue with the stock turbo.. this leads my logic to other places.

V-Mount? This is all opinion, and if i am wrong then please let me know.

The I/C looks small, and is it painted? It also looks like you have no ducting (going in or out). The reasoning behind the v-mount is the rapid pull of air from the bottom of the bumper to exit the hood (because heat rises). Vmount "vent?". If this is NOT the issue, Fuel pressure, correct spark, boost changes without fuel correction are next on my list.

If ran properly in stock form, the SR should get at least 100k miles out of the stock head gasket.

To the point: No matter what gasket you put on the engine you will repeat the same problem if the cause still exists. What made the head gasket go?

[Markovich]

im tearing the engine down now its out of the car and i just need to firgure out what size are the headbolts? 8 or 9 mm hex? when i bought the engine i got impation and threw the sr in not doing anything and i regret doing that now but o well i learnd my lession. any way when i bought the motor i think it was blown now looking back on to it. i do knwo i dont have good compression and the rings are bad. cylinder 1 had 110 cylinder 2 had 80 cylinder 3 had 100 cylinder 4 had 115. then the wet test showed 125, 100, 115, 125 so i need new rings. but the stock hg will be fine that is great news for my bank account lol. i am getting my hood vented now and before the motor goes back in im making vents and getting new fans and radiator. so that should all be good thank ytou guys for actually giving me answers too unlike some people....

peace

[Markovich]

wasnt a blowen head gasket it was fine but the rings are bad. so does anyone hear have the correct specs of a redtop sr20det? if so pm me thnx

peace

[johngriff]

p/m sent! with pics and p/n