ser20detttt

[matic 240sx]

ok, this is going to sound crazy but oh well...  i was thinking... i saw that sr20det with the 2 turbos and i thought what if he quaded it..

you can have one turbo going to cyl 1 and 4 and the other turbo going to cyl 2 and 3....

then you put smaller turbos on those two turbos to spool the bigger ones up faster... eh?  

would that work?

[MingMing]

...
no
thing is twin turbos work only on V config engines because of the two exhaust manifolds
(one for each \ /)
in the sr20, it could be a sequential, where the smaller one spools up faster to reduce turbo lag, and then the bigger one kicks in for optimum power
but i dont see how he could get a tt in there.. because with only one exhaust manifold, you'd hafta split the exhaust up perfectly or else u'll get unbalanced boosts from each turbo...
and more turbos dont always mean more power, cuz he has to use his exhaust to power it still, and the more turbos u h av, the less power u'll get outta each
1 spinnign turbo is still the best for i4's.. so prolly shud be a sequential...

[konkman]

You could twin turbo an SR engine, don't know why anyone would want to, but you could.

You need to install a custom manifod that has mounts for 2 turobs, then have alot of custom piping to link your exhaust and intercooler piping back together.

Why twin turbo when you can install just one big turbo.  More parts means more to go wrong.

KISS!!!

[ca18guy]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Quote: from matic 240sx on 3:57 am on Nov. 23, 2001
ok, this is going to sound crazy but oh well... i was thinking... i saw that sr20det with the 2 turbos and i thought what if he quaded it..

you can have one turbo going to cyl 1 and 4 and the other turbo going to cyl 2 and 3....

then you put smaller turbos on those two turbos to spool the bigger ones up faster... eh?

would that work?
</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>

First off let me say that the most effeicent way would be to stick with one turbo. Now what your saying is have a big turbo then have a smaller turbo down the exhaust track. Would it work? Yes anything can be done. Would it make sense? No. You would have 2 cyliders pushing one large turbo and one small turbo. A turbo can only spin as fast as the air pushing it, so you would have 2 turbo's being pushed by 2 piston's, the piston's are also working harder to push the 2 turbo's because the turbo's are causing restriction on the exhaust flow. So you have a large turbo being powered with 1/2 the airflow it should get then after the exhaust gases past that they need to power another turbo, it's just to ineffecient. Well it's hard to explain, i tried, hope I made alittle sense. I'm not gonna mention about how hard it would be to fit quad turbos under the hood <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':)'>

[matic 240sx]

heh... &nbsp;i see, well i know you can twin turbo it because ive already seen it done... &nbsp;i see what your saying ca18guy that makes sense... &nbsp;im still learning about turbos and what not... <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':)'>

but what do you think would be better on a sr20det? &nbsp;single turbo? &nbsp;
2 turbo (smaller one to spool up bigger one)?
2 turbo (1 for two cyl. and 1 for other two cyl.)?

most efficient and least cost restrictive would be the single large turbo.

[MingMing]

if u'd read what we said before, a tt on a non V config engine is useless, inefficient, and expensive
sequentials cost more money
so yea, get a large turbo
or if ur not into drag, get a medium turbo for better powerband

that sr20det was not sequential right? it looked like it could be quite an efficient design.

[matic 240sx]

well, money is not a big issue... &nbsp; and tt on a non V config engine is not useless.... &nbsp;you must know to much about turbos yourself... :x

[White240sx]

If you want a wide streetable power band, go with a properly sized T3/T4. There is no advantage of having a TT 4-cylinder other than being to only one to have one. Plumbing sequentials would be a PITA and power wouldn't be any broader than a proper sized single. Sizing is what makes the difference in a turbo, you can stick with the T25/T28 that comes with the SR and have no noticeable lag, or you can throw on a strait T4 and have a peaky power band with a strong lag feel. AFAIK there are no real TT SR's in existence, the picture floating around is just some guys screwing around and they decided to rest another turbo on top of the mounted one. Derek Greaser runs an HKS GT3037 on his SR and puts out 320hp. From the dyno sheets I’ve seen the power curve seems pretty flat, but it is defiantly peakier than some of the Turbo KA's that put down similar numbers.

If you look around at some of the outrageously overpowered cars around 700hp+, (Skylines, Supras) they either run a giant single, or big twins. Even the Turbo V configurations never run more than 2.

So basically if you want big numbers, go with a big turbo, if you want no lag go with what comes on it. If you want a compromise go with a properly sized &quot;medium&quot; turbo, keep things simple, and just remember, if it really works, then a lot more people are going to be using it.

[matic 240sx]

its not that im going to do this or want to do this.. its just a discussion.. like i said im still learning about turbos.. and there is an eclipse in washington twin turbo... and why would someone have 2 turbo manifolds made for a picture?

for the guy who said u can only TT a V

skyline = TT inline 6



(Edited by matic 240sx at 3:40 am on Nov. 24, 2001)

[White240sx]

&quot;its not that im going to do this or want to do this.. its just a discussion.. like i said im still learning about turbos..&quot;


Yeah, I gathered this; I’m just trying to clear up some misconceptions.:)


&quot;and there is an eclipse in washington twin turbo...&quot;


Is it a show car or does it actually race? I know there is a triple turbo supra somewhere but is a show car.


&quot;and why would someone have 2 turbo manifolds made for a picture?&quot;


If this is the picture I’m thinking of, they just rested another turbo on top of the manifold of the equipped turbo (which is a bottom mound) so it appeared to be a TT.


(Edited by White240sx at 3:11 am on Nov. 24, 2001)

[MingMing]

<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':p'> yea and they also got a V config engine to run a single turbo

just sayin for his car it'd be quite pointless
althou i hav no idea how an inline runs two same sized turbos...

Not to stir up some sht, but the Bugati EB110 is quad turbo. Don't know how ecactly it works. &nbsp;And I thought you were only allowed 2 in prder to pass inspection. Not cuz of emmissions, although that would be a problem, but cuz of the fact that you have 2 frikin turbos already. &nbsp;Could just be street rumors. &nbsp;Never bothered to check myself <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/sad.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':('>

[matic 240sx]

my friend david has a 11 second eclipse... he use to be a member of some big eclipse club in washington and one of his good friends races and twin turbo eclipse. &nbsp;and in the picture i saw of the sr20dett you can clearly see the 2 different sets of manifold piping... &nbsp;

[mistert]

uhh yeah the bugatti can be quad turbo, because it is a W-16, meaning it has 4 separate intake manifolds. think of it as 4 different 4-bangers all wedged into one engine, or 2 v8's merged into one.

[Red89AllStockBiotch]

Haven't you guys heard of the SR20DETT? it's a twin turbo inline 4 produced by nissan, very very rare though http://www.geocities.com/mtuell_2000/dettsr.jpg

[AKADriver]

That's not factory. &nbsp;Why did you just dig up a year old thread?

[SaintlyCharBoy]

the rb26dett runs twins on an i6, correct, but the exhaust pulses are gathered from the cylinders in such a way as to keep the turbines spinning continuously

if you were to quad a 4 each turbo would be minute, and recieve jarring pulses

a well sized single will always be more efficient than smaller duals:
1 less moving pieces to break
2 larger exhaust flow area in one bigun ("back pressure" is the bane of your turbo's power)
3 guaranteed better pulse timing
4 that monster intake bell just looks so damned cool

[the3SecondJerk]

Well I dunno about totally inefficient a twin turbo is....a single large turbo will increase lag greatly. here is some info just to share...Most twin-turbo engines have the turbochargers arranged to operate independently, each serves one bank of cylinders. This is so-called "Parallel Twin-Turbo". An alternative arrangement, "Sequential Twin-Turbo", was designed to improve response and further reduce turbo lag. The turbos operate sequentially, that is, at low speed, all the limited amount of exhaust gas is directed to drive one of the small turbines, leaving another idle. Therefore the first turbine will accelerate quickly. When the exhaust flow reaches sufficient amount to drive both turbos, the second turbo intervenes and helps reaching the maximum boost pressure. Unfortunately, sequential twin-turbo requires very complicated connection of pipes (exhaust from both banks should reach both turbos; so do the intake pipes from both banks), thus is now losing interest from car makers. Porsche 959, Mazda 3rd generation RX7, Toyota Supra and Subaru Legacy, I am not too sure about the Nissan Skyline though.

[SilviaDriver]

well i didnt read everything, but ill post anyways i dont know much about turbo but, i dont think thats a good idea 1cyl spoolin up a turbo small or not i dont think it can happen not enough gas or watever to spool it. like the SR20DETT had two small t25 turbos, 2 cyl pushin a turbo and it was LAAaaaggg

[xhdriver]

but it looks so fucking awesome

&nbsp;big TT &nbsp;(i know its a RB, but i couldnt find the TT sr)

[adey]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (sidewayzCA18 @ Sep. 17 2002,8:17)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Porsche 959, Mazda 3rd generation RX7, Toyota Supra and Subaru Legacy, I am not too sure about the Nissan Skyline though.</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
I was under the impression that only the RX7 and possibly the 959 of all your mentioned cars were sequential. I know for sure the RX7 is sequential, but I believe the supra, legacy B4 and skyline are all parallel turbos.

that said, it seems like more of you ("us") need to do a lot more reading. &nbsp;<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/sly.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':sly:'> &nbsp;No offence to any individuals, but that's just the feeling I get from this conversation and where it's going. &nbsp;<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/sigh.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=''>

[boosteds14]

what>??

if anything, if u attempted to do this u would need like gt15 turbos inorder to spool, 2cylinders will not have enough exhaust gas to push the turbine wheel, plus use that compresses air to push another turbo, there will be so much choking up that the engine will run like shit if ur able to actually get positive manifold pressure.
plus it just looks cooler to see one single huge turbo.

[Kreator]

Blah. all the noobz heh

Anyways, i don't really see any difference between having a twin turbo setup or a single turbo. You are pushing the same air, and u are using the same exhaust energy to spin them up. If your argument is that 2 smaller turbos are easier to spin up than one big turbo, than think about high rpms, when your small turbos are gonna be overpsinning like mofos, cuz there is much more energy to spin them both. Basicly i think the V type engines use twin turbos for better design and since big turbos are more expensive. If you fuck up one big turbo, u'd have to pay alot more money than if you fuck up a small one. I might be wron on this, so if someone with knowledge can explain, it'd be cool.

Anyways, I don't know why skyline has twins, maybe again for better design (think again of those long exhaust runners. Alot of heat is lost while those suckers get the exhaust gas from the cyllinders to the turbo). But i've heard of a number of twin-turbo cars that were later converted to a single larger turbo.

Sequential though, has much better effect, cuz the first smaller turbo is used to spin up hte larger one. Kinda same thing as using nitrous to spin up a turbo car

[uiuc240]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Guest @ Nov. 25 2001,03:39)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Not to stir up some sht, but the Bugati EB110 is quad turbo. Don't know how ecactly it works. And I thought you were only allowed 2 in prder to pass inspection. Not cuz of emmissions, although that would be a problem, but cuz of the fact that you have 2 frikin turbos already. Could just be street rumors. Never bothered to check myself <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/sad.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=''></td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
who is this guy ^^^ with no info?<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='???'>

wierd.

BTW, this thread is ghey.

Eric

[tnord]

i can't believe nobody has brought up heat issues in this whole thread. now, i'm no mr. wizard or bill nye, but iirc, keeping the engine cool is a major issue with turbo cars. turbo's can actually glow red from the heat that is created by these things. 1 turbo is hard enough to cool, but 4 of em, in as close of proximity they would have to be in, that's a nightmare if i've ever heard of one. i can't even imagine what the plumbing would look like, something like medusa's hair i guess. sequential turbo's are by no means useless. all of you who are complaining about low end losses from too big of exhausts, i'd like to hear your complaints about turbo lag. sequential is the solution to that problem. although, the biggest hp cars are just huge non-sequential snails. but then you run into traction problems. turbo's aren't a new thing, if a setup like this actually worked, somebody woulda already done it.

[ca18guy]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (uiuc240 @ Sep. 19 2002,04:51)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Guest @ Nov. 25 2001,03:39)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Not to stir up some sht, but the Bugati EB110 is quad turbo. Don't know how ecactly it works. And I thought you were only allowed 2 in prder to pass inspection. Not cuz of emmissions, although that would be a problem, but cuz of the fact that you have 2 frikin turbos already. Could just be street rumors. Never bothered to check myself <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/sad.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=''></td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
who is this guy ^^^ with no info?<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='???'>

wierd.

BTW, this thread is ghey.

Eric</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
Banned just like the person that bumped this thread should be

Good catch Tnord, heat from the turbos never even crossed my mind.

[Kreator]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (tnord @ Sep. 18 2002,12:18)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">i can't believe nobody has brought up heat issues in this whole thread. now, i'm no mr. wizard or bill nye, but iirc, keeping the engine cool is a major issue with turbo cars. turbo's can actually glow red from the heat that is created by these things. 1 turbo is hard enough to cool, but 4 of em, in as close of proximity they would have to be in, that's a nightmare if i've ever heard of one. i can't even imagine what the plumbing would look like, something like medusa's hair i guess. sequential turbo's are by no means useless. all of you who are complaining about low end losses from too big of exhausts, i'd like to hear your complaints about turbo lag. sequential is the solution to that problem. although, the biggest hp cars are just huge non-sequential snails. but then you run into traction problems. turbo's aren't a new thing, if a setup like this actually worked, somebody woulda already done it.</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
That's actually what i kinda meant when i said design. I was gonna say plumbing, but wasn't sure if it was the right word. The v design engines use twins cuz they are on the opposite sides and don't affect each other, while a single large turbo would prolly heat up much more since it would have twice as many cyllinders pushing it.

[240 2NR]

Did anyone ever see the simpsons where Bart's class went to the police station and he set all the megaphones in front of each other and said testBOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOM! &nbsp;

Sorry, this post just got me thinking about that because its seems like that's how people think turbos work. &nbsp;Amplifying any little exhaust pulse into mad power. &nbsp;One works great so four work better when in fact you are over engineering a very simple answer. &nbsp;

To add to Tnord's post, just think of all the intercoolers for that thing, or at least all the pipes feeding into one really big one.