Driving feel of 240sx - Zilvia.net Forums | Nissan 240SX (Silvia) and Z (Fairlady) Car Forum

Dark · 11-09-2002, 04:58 AM

I've been thinking about this for a while. So here is my question how would you compare the driving feel of your 240sx to other cars? By this I mean how connected to the road did the car make you feel. Was steering input enough? Was it too light or too heavy? How were the brakes? Seating position? Details would be great.

Second part of the Question is what mods helped make your car feel more connected. I know about coilovers, Sway Bars, LSD, Strut Tower Bars. But does changing the T/C Rod Bushings or buying new control arms really help.

The reason I'm asking is I got the chance to test drive a 2002 Mercedes S500 and at 220 KMPH (137 mph) the car felt rock solid. I wish I had more time to drive it but I'm grateful that I did. I'll never be able to afford something like that but I want my car to handle just as well.

<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/thumbs-up.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':thumbsup:'>

max power · 11-09-2002, 05:08 AM

my s14 rides rough. I can feel most minor imperfections in the road. stock SE suspention.  I don't want to take it past 100 because the wheels need to be aligned, but at ~100 it's very responsive and sticks to asphault like syrup!  Right now I'm driving like a girl so i can get used to stick <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='

'>

my opinion may be scewed because I've been riding in a v6 chevy sedan for the past 2 years and just recently hopped into the nissan <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='

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max power · 11-09-2002, 05:17 AM

look into BMWs.  Someone I know worked for a BMW dealership for ~12 years and one day a 700 series bmw (12 cyl) rolled in for an oil change.  Not sure if this is beleivable, but he had it up to 240mph on the NJ turnpike.  He still had full control of the car and said it wasn't even maxed out.  <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/cool.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='

'>

Red Comet X · 11-09-2002, 10:21 AM

yea my s14 rides like a brick. Super hard and unforgiving. But its good in the corners. Thats all that matters to me..

11-09-2002, 10:55 AM

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (max power @ Nov. 09 2002,05:17)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"> Not sure if this is beleivable, but he had it up to 240mph on the NJ turnpike. He still had full control of the car and said it wasn't even maxed out. <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/cool.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='

'></td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
Um, no. 240km/h maybe, but definately not 240mph.

AutoDestruct · 11-09-2002, 10:55 AM

Do you know how much horsepower it takes to make a 5000 pound object reach 240 mph???   <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/crazy.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':crazy:'>

*revat619* · 11-09-2002, 01:26 PM

my S14 rides pretty rough (stock base model suspension) the thing is, my dads bmw 540i rides better and his is lowered

come to think of it, its not that surprising considering its bmw. I cant beat him in anything: better suspension and wider wheels for the turns (17x8 and 17x9) and a V8 for the straights.

still love my 240 though <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/inlove.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='

'>

gabossie · 11-09-2002, 02:24 PM

When you want to drive grip, it's about as tight as....Well just say it's pretty tight. But when you want to break it loose, there isn't a problem with that either. In general, it's no M3, but it's a hell of a lot of fun and a good car to learn great technique in, or so I have been told. I know I love mine. <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/alien.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':alien:'>

Natty · 11-09-2002, 03:06 PM

Like a Porsche 944 or 924.

logo20 · 11-10-2002, 12:59 AM

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Like a Porsche 944 or 924.
</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>

I have a s13, with suspension upgrade, and it handles alot better than the 944 (at least the one I drove).  

If you wanna know how 240sx handles, go to a dealer and test drive one.   <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/satisfied.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':satisfied:'>

Kaede · 11-10-2002, 02:04 AM

I drove an 320i, M3, M5, SLK, integra, RSX before for my valet job. The M5 and SLK were fun to drive, though the seating and clutch pedal was somewhat akward in the SLK. The steering and cornering abilities of these 2 cars are great. Smooth ride also. The Jaguar X-type was also fun. The steering control on that car is the best out of all the cars I driven. I think RSX is cool (love the seats), but its somewhat difficult to measure space, couldn't even see the hood. Wish I drove that Z8, but the other valets got ahead of me, damn.

My '92 fastback is cool, but it needs some work on the suspension and tires. Everytime I make a sharp turn, it feels as if the tires are gonna lose traction. I think my tranny or clutch is also messed up. No matter how careful I try to balance the clutch, it rarely engages smoothly in 2nd gear. I don't know if its me or the car. I have no problem engaging the clutch smootly in other cars. I need to try driving another 240 to compare the tranny and suspension.

MorganS13 · 11-10-2002, 01:07 PM

i worked as a valet and at a dealership for quite a while.  i'd have to say the thing i like most of my S13 is that i can throw it around and it just comes back asking for more, its the kind of car that just likes to be driven hard.  i know it can't touch most BMWs or mercedes, S2000, etc in stock form, but i feel a lot better throwing this car around than something that costs $20+.  for the price its a LOT of fun short of a miata for a reliable daily driver (no offense but u'd never catch me in a miata  <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/hmmm.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':hmmm:'> )

AutoDestruct · 11-10-2002, 03:03 PM

Kaede, I think the prob. that you are refering to is called "rubberbanding"  It is caused by worn out bushings mounts, shocks struts, Etc.  It is the play in the entire suspension from standing still till fully acclerated.  This force rotates the car backwards and the back of the car downwards as the clutch is applied.  This causes a rubberbanding of the powertrain and a corresponding shake of the car as the momentary slip of power  is absorbed.

P.S.   I have been up for almost 2 days.  But I think this is what you are talking about.

P.S.*2   Morgan,  You know what they say about people who drive miatas.   Right ?       Haha ha hahah a

<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/alien.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':alien:'>

gabossie · 11-10-2002, 03:18 PM

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (AutoDestruct @ Nov. 10 2002,4:03)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">P.S.*2 Morgan, You know what they say about people who drive miatas. Right ? Haha ha hahah a

<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/alien.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':alien:'></td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
They say their quick little fuckers at an autox....

That and they are g..........nevermind <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/alien.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':alien:'>

Seriously though, you get what you pay for, and sometimes you get more. Yes, when you are rich and famous like I will be <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/lookaround.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':look:'> , you can buy a horribly expensive car that handles like a dream and had a much larger engine. Until then, you want to get the most for your money, and I guarantee that you will have a hell of a time finding something that performs better than a 240 for the amount of money you invest.

adey · 11-10-2002, 03:50 PM

Comparing my '93 S13 hatch (coilovers/tie rod ends) to my 2001.5 GTi 1.8T (chipped) and my mom's '95 328i (E36, auto), I can only say that the 240 kills them in the turns (thanks to coilovers), but the BMW feels smoother in the turns-- even if you can't take them as fast. The GTi is only superior in terms of raw, straight-line power. Overtaking on freeways only needs the press of your right foot... no downshifting required!

Steering on the S13 is by far the best, but this is also thanks to my coilovers/pillowball mounts, new tie rod ends, and 310mm steering wheel (that's super heavy.) BMW's steering comes in second, they're such a pleasure to drive, and GTi is last. It's steering, while precise enough for 90% of driving, it's not nearly as firm/sure-footed as the S13, but is comfortable (sort of like the BMW) to drive. The BM is nicer because the steering response is great (thanks to 50/50 balance and FR layout).

In terms of Power though, the S13 is way back there. <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='

'> The GTi (~170hp to the front wheels) is easily the fastest, the BM in second (thanks partly to auto tranny), and lassssst is the S13 with it's roughly 105hp to the rear wheels. heh.

now... ride comfort... it's hard to decide which is nicer between the BMW and the GTi... the BM is definitely more luxurious, but the GTi also has a v. quiet cabin with a pretty smooth ride. The 17" (stock) rims on the GTi makes it harder than the 15" rims of the 328i, though. S13 is way down there thanks to bad LA roads and 8/6 spring rates... plus it's super duper noisy in the cabin thanks to no seats and an in-the-process-of-being-stripped-interior. <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='

'>

All in all, I'm super-impressed with the BMW. It has adequate power and takes turns very well (would do better w/ summer compound tires) while maintaining a very nice street ride.
The S13 drives BEAUTIFULLY in the hills thanks to coilovers, but suffers in the areas of power and daily streetability. I love any sorts of turns in this car.
The GTi is a nice-ish compromise, it has more than enough power, but handles relatively poorly compared to the 8-year old BMW 328i and 10 year old 240sx.

Hmmm... did I miss anything?

adey · 11-10-2002, 04:02 PM

Addendum:
High speed stability-

GTi:
Taken GTi up to 138mph, and the thing is stable! no rattles or sounds other than the wind rushing by and the tires on the not-so-great freeway (--I mean, TRACK.... *ahem*) surface.

240sx:
Taken up to fuel cutoff (~115). Stable (with the coilovers) and composed, but nowhere near as comfortable as driving (fast) as the GTi.

328i:
Taken up to about 140km/h (about 70mph - speed limits back home are nowhere near as fast as here, and no open hwys without cameras) and is super smooth. I imagine this car to be similar to the GTi, only with a fuel cutoff a little earlier. (GTi has no fuel cutoff, i.e. if possible, I could hit redline in 5th)

240Driver39 · 11-10-2002, 11:01 PM

Well, just to add on a lil bit, i just got done drivin about 450miles cruising in open flowing traffic this weekend, driving to New York and back in my S13.

I just found this car nice to cruise in, it seems very stable even at higher speeds, and will aptly accelerate in 5th gear if needed to overtake a vehicle.  It pulls nicely imo when u need the power. I however dont have access to compare much like adey, all i have to compare to is my 92 Sentra SE, which is not a sports car haha.

i love the handling in the car though, thats the first thing i fell in love with when i bought the car, its just tight to the road.  It may be "underpowered", but i still enjoy the power it has.  Its not totally a smooth revving sports car, but it puts me back in my seat a lil, and sounds damn nice haha

just my input, im very happy with my car  <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/thumbs-up.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':thumbsup:'>

drifterX87 · 11-11-2002, 05:59 AM

Youre comparing to different types of cars though, the Mercedes, which is a GT car, is meant for highways and high speeds.  Therefore they make it heavier, and make some other differences in suspension than in the S chassis.  The Silvia for example, is not meant to run at 300kmh like the Mercedes, its meant for the twisties, so they make it light, nimble, and able to turn on small corners really quickly.

Mike

s14 RL · 11-11-2002, 12:12 PM

If you're looking for high speed stability, as mentioned you should look into more of a GT car--in a car like a Supra, 300zx, or 3000GT.  They'll feel great at high speeds (i.e. 130+mph) but I can guarantee they won't feel as nimble just based on the 500+ lb weight difference between them and a typical 240sx.  It all depends on what you want out of it.

s14 RL · 11-11-2002, 12:13 PM

If you get another chance, take the Mercedes into an area where you can push its cornering ability to the limit--this will help you to get a better idea of what you like (I can't imagine a 4000+lb mercedes as having crisp handling at 10/10 in comparison to a 240sx).

nrcooled · 11-11-2002, 01:52 PM

When I took my '91 s13 w/ stock suspension to the track it was responsive and very forgiving.  I made a lot of mistakes i.e. taking corners too fast, braking too late, missing apexes and the like and she didn't penalize me at all.  Never got the ass end to step out too much and she wouldn't nose dive and push in corners.  And this is also w/ an SR at 13psi.

I couldn't think of a better car for myself to learn in. <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='

'>   I was very impressed also w/ the stock SE suspension in how it handled very fast turns (downhill of camber turns at 70-80mph) and also blasting down the front straight at 125mph ::no governor  <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='

'> ::  then going around the kink at 125mph non-the-less.  She never felt like she was out of her element

hell I don't know why I didn't do this sooner <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='???'>  <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='

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Dark · 11-11-2002, 02:50 PM

Thanks Adey for the feedback. I'm already looking into the smaller steering wheel and new TC rods will be a definite. Right now I just want to improve feedback from my car and these two mods should do the job (I don't have a lot to spend right now). Next on my list would be a VLSD and sub-frame spacers. My priority at the moment is to bring the car back to shape once that is done then the rest should be easy.

Now I realize that the VR-4, S500 and 740IL are all great cars in their own way but none of them cost me three grand to acquire. The 240sx is a great car I love it for what it is. A fun, cheap and reliable sports car that being said my question to you is if you had the chance to drive a 911 Turbo, Modena or Vanquish would you? I had a chance to drive a S500 and I jumped on it. There are some things that I liked about it others I wasn't too fond of but in the end it was a fun experience.

The reason I bought my 240SX was to improve my driving ability and I think it's a great car for doing that. I've been driving for four years now. I've learned a whole lot but if I want to improve even more then the next obvious step is autocross. For now all I want to do is Improve feel and become comfortable with my car.

<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='

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11-09-2002, 04:58 AM	#1
Dark Zilvia Member Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Arlington, VA Posts: 165 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	I've been thinking about this for a while. So here is my question how would you compare the driving feel of your 240sx to other cars? By this I mean how connected to the road did the car make you feel. Was steering input enough? Was it too light or too heavy? How were the brakes? Seating position? Details would be great. Second part of the Question is what mods helped make your car feel more connected. I know about coilovers, Sway Bars, LSD, Strut Tower Bars. But does changing the T/C Rod Bushings or buying new control arms really help. The reason I'm asking is I got the chance to test drive a 2002 Mercedes S500 and at 220 KMPH (137 mph) the car felt rock solid. I wish I had more time to drive it but I'm grateful that I did. I'll never be able to afford something like that but I want my car to handle just as well. <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/thumbs-up.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':thumbsup:'> __________________ 93 Fastback, 5spd with obx shortshifter Power is in the control of strength.

11-09-2002, 05:08 AM	#2
max power Leaky Injector Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: philly Posts: 94 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	my s14 rides rough. I can feel most minor imperfections in the road. stock SE suspention.  I don't want to take it past 100 because the wheels need to be aligned, but at ~100 it's very responsive and sticks to asphault like syrup!  Right now I'm driving like a girl so i can get used to stick <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=''> my opinion may be scewed because I've been riding in a v6 chevy sedan for the past 2 years and just recently hopped into the nissan <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=''>

11-09-2002, 05:17 AM	#3
max power Leaky Injector Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: philly Posts: 94 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	look into BMWs.  Someone I know worked for a BMW dealership for ~12 years and one day a 700 series bmw (12 cyl) rolled in for an oil change.  Not sure if this is beleivable, but he had it up to 240mph on the NJ turnpike.  He still had full control of the car and said it wasn't even maxed out.  <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/cool.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=''>

11-09-2002, 10:55 AM	#5
sxtasy Guest Posts: n/a	</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (max power @ Nov. 09 2002,05:17)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"> Not sure if this is beleivable, but he had it up to 240mph on the NJ turnpike. He still had full control of the car and said it wasn't even maxed out. <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/cool.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=''></td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'> Um, no. 240km/h maybe, but definately not 240mph.

11-09-2002, 01:26 PM	#7
revat619 Retired General Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: San Diego Posts: 4,672 Trader Rating: (7) Feedback Score: 7 reviews	my S14 rides pretty rough (stock base model suspension) the thing is, my dads bmw 540i rides better and his is lowered come to think of it, its not that surprising considering its bmw. I cant beat him in anything: better suspension and wider wheels for the turns (17x8 and 17x9) and a V8 for the straights. still love my 240 though <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/inlove.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=''> __________________ www.Jspec.com www.SpeedAlliance.com www.PoweredByMax.net Instagram: @rjsladerade

11-09-2002, 10:21 AM	#4
Red Comet X Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: San Diego, CA Posts: 35 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	yea my s14 rides like a brick. Super hard and unforgiving. But its good in the corners. Thats all that matters to me..

11-09-2002, 10:55 AM	#6
AutoDestruct Zilvia Junkie Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: The Burg, Harrisburg Posts: 437 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	Do you know how much horsepower it takes to make a 5000 pound object reach 240 mph???   <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/crazy.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':crazy:'>

11-09-2002, 03:06 PM	#9
Natty Zilvia Addict Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Nashville, TN Posts: 944 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	Like a Porsche 944 or 924. __________________ 1991 White 240sx Fastback LE, rusty spoiler, weak driveshaft, exhaust rattle.... Rattles are just your cars way of saying 'I love you.'

11-10-2002, 12:59 AM	#10
logo20 Zilvia Junkie Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Houston, TX Posts: 345 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Like a Porsche 944 or 924. </td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'> I have a s13, with suspension upgrade, and it handles alot better than the 944 (at least the one I drove).   If you wanna know how 240sx handles, go to a dealer and test drive one.   <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/satisfied.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':satisfied:'> __________________ http://community.webshots.com/user/logo20

11-10-2002, 02:04 AM	#11
Kaede Zilvia Member Join Date: May 2002 Location: S.F. Posts: 174 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	I drove an 320i, M3, M5, SLK, integra, RSX before for my valet job. The M5 and SLK were fun to drive, though the seating and clutch pedal was somewhat akward in the SLK. The steering and cornering abilities of these 2 cars are great. Smooth ride also. The Jaguar X-type was also fun. The steering control on that car is the best out of all the cars I driven. I think RSX is cool (love the seats), but its somewhat difficult to measure space, couldn't even see the hood. Wish I drove that Z8, but the other valets got ahead of me, damn. My '92 fastback is cool, but it needs some work on the suspension and tires. Everytime I make a sharp turn, it feels as if the tires are gonna lose traction. I think my tranny or clutch is also messed up. No matter how careful I try to balance the clutch, it rarely engages smoothly in 2nd gear. I don't know if its me or the car. I have no problem engaging the clutch smootly in other cars. I need to try driving another 240 to compare the tranny and suspension.

11-10-2002, 01:07 PM	#12
MorganS13 Zilvia Addict Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Midwest Posts: 707 Trader Rating: (1) Feedback Score: 1 reviews	i worked as a valet and at a dealership for quite a while.  i'd have to say the thing i like most of my S13 is that i can throw it around and it just comes back asking for more, its the kind of car that just likes to be driven hard.  i know it can't touch most BMWs or mercedes, S2000, etc in stock form, but i feel a lot better throwing this car around than something that costs $20+.  for the price its a LOT of fun short of a miata for a reliable daily driver (no offense but u'd never catch me in a miata  <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/hmmm.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':hmmm:'> )

11-10-2002, 03:03 PM	#13
AutoDestruct Zilvia Junkie Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: The Burg, Harrisburg Posts: 437 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	Kaede, I think the prob. that you are refering to is called "rubberbanding"  It is caused by worn out bushings mounts, shocks struts, Etc.  It is the play in the entire suspension from standing still till fully acclerated.  This force rotates the car backwards and the back of the car downwards as the clutch is applied.  This causes a rubberbanding of the powertrain and a corresponding shake of the car as the momentary slip of power  is absorbed. P.S.   I have been up for almost 2 days.  But I think this is what you are talking about. P.S.*2   Morgan,  You know what they say about people who drive miatas.   Right ?       Haha ha hahah a <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/alien.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':alien:'>

11-10-2002, 03:50 PM	#15
adey Post Whore! Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Hong Kong Posts: 3,072 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	Comparing my '93 S13 hatch (coilovers/tie rod ends) to my 2001.5 GTi 1.8T (chipped) and my mom's '95 328i (E36, auto), I can only say that the 240 kills them in the turns (thanks to coilovers), but the BMW feels smoother in the turns-- even if you can't take them as fast. The GTi is only superior in terms of raw, straight-line power. Overtaking on freeways only needs the press of your right foot... no downshifting required! Steering on the S13 is by far the best, but this is also thanks to my coilovers/pillowball mounts, new tie rod ends, and 310mm steering wheel (that's super heavy.) BMW's steering comes in second, they're such a pleasure to drive, and GTi is last. It's steering, while precise enough for 90% of driving, it's not nearly as firm/sure-footed as the S13, but is comfortable (sort of like the BMW) to drive. The BM is nicer because the steering response is great (thanks to 50/50 balance and FR layout). In terms of Power though, the S13 is way back there. <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=''> The GTi (~170hp to the front wheels) is easily the fastest, the BM in second (thanks partly to auto tranny), and lassssst is the S13 with it's roughly 105hp to the rear wheels. heh. now... ride comfort... it's hard to decide which is nicer between the BMW and the GTi... the BM is definitely more luxurious, but the GTi also has a v. quiet cabin with a pretty smooth ride. The 17" (stock) rims on the GTi makes it harder than the 15" rims of the 328i, though. S13 is way down there thanks to bad LA roads and 8/6 spring rates... plus it's super duper noisy in the cabin thanks to no seats and an in-the-process-of-being-stripped-interior. <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=''> All in all, I'm super-impressed with the BMW. It has adequate power and takes turns very well (would do better w/ summer compound tires) while maintaining a very nice street ride. The S13 drives BEAUTIFULLY in the hills thanks to coilovers, but suffers in the areas of power and daily streetability. I love any sorts of turns in this car. The GTi is a nice-ish compromise, it has more than enough power, but handles relatively poorly compared to the 8-year old BMW 328i and 10 year old 240sx. Hmmm... did I miss anything? __________________ Instagram: @SX180HKG

11-10-2002, 04:02 PM	#16
adey Post Whore! Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Hong Kong Posts: 3,072 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	Addendum: High speed stability- GTi: Taken GTi up to 138mph, and the thing is stable! no rattles or sounds other than the wind rushing by and the tires on the not-so-great freeway (--I mean, TRACK.... ahem) surface. 240sx: Taken up to fuel cutoff (~115). Stable (with the coilovers) and composed, but nowhere near as comfortable as driving (fast) as the GTi. 328i: Taken up to about 140km/h (about 70mph - speed limits back home are nowhere near as fast as here, and no open hwys without cameras) and is super smooth. I imagine this car to be similar to the GTi, only with a fuel cutoff a little earlier. (GTi has no fuel cutoff, i.e. if possible, I could hit redline in 5th) __________________ Instagram: @SX180HKG

11-10-2002, 11:01 PM	#17
240Driver39 Zilvia FREAK! Join Date: May 2002 Location: Charleston, SC Age: 40 Posts: 1,090 Trader Rating: (1) Rides Gallery: 240Driver39 Feedback Score: 1 reviews	Well, just to add on a lil bit, i just got done drivin about 450miles cruising in open flowing traffic this weekend, driving to New York and back in my S13. I just found this car nice to cruise in, it seems very stable even at higher speeds, and will aptly accelerate in 5th gear if needed to overtake a vehicle.  It pulls nicely imo when u need the power. I however dont have access to compare much like adey, all i have to compare to is my 92 Sentra SE, which is not a sports car haha. i love the handling in the car though, thats the first thing i fell in love with when i bought the car, its just tight to the road.  It may be "underpowered", but i still enjoy the power it has.  Its not totally a smooth revving sports car, but it puts me back in my seat a lil, and sounds damn nice haha just my input, im very happy with my car  <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/thumbs-up.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':thumbsup:'> __________________ 1990 240sx 5spd fastback

11-11-2002, 05:59 AM	#18
drifterX87 Zilvia Member Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Charlotte, NC Posts: 268 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	Youre comparing to different types of cars though, the Mercedes, which is a GT car, is meant for highways and high speeds.  Therefore they make it heavier, and make some other differences in suspension than in the S chassis.  The Silvia for example, is not meant to run at 300kmh like the Mercedes, its meant for the twisties, so they make it light, nimble, and able to turn on small corners really quickly. Mike

11-11-2002, 12:12 PM	#19
s14 RL Leaky Injector Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: OC Posts: 66 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	If you're looking for high speed stability, as mentioned you should look into more of a GT car--in a car like a Supra, 300zx, or 3000GT.  They'll feel great at high speeds (i.e. 130+mph) but I can guarantee they won't feel as nimble just based on the 500+ lb weight difference between them and a typical 240sx.  It all depends on what you want out of it.

11-11-2002, 12:13 PM	#20
s14 RL Leaky Injector Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: OC Posts: 66 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	If you get another chance, take the Mercedes into an area where you can push its cornering ability to the limit--this will help you to get a better idea of what you like (I can't imagine a 4000+lb mercedes as having crisp handling at 10/10 in comparison to a 240sx).

11-11-2002, 01:52 PM	#21
nrcooled Nissanaholic! Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Turn 8 'bout to get rolled by a SC'd ITR Age: 46 Posts: 1,849 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	When I took my '91 s13 w/ stock suspension to the track it was responsive and very forgiving.  I made a lot of mistakes i.e. taking corners too fast, braking too late, missing apexes and the like and she didn't penalize me at all.  Never got the ass end to step out too much and she wouldn't nose dive and push in corners.  And this is also w/ an SR at 13psi. I couldn't think of a better car for myself to learn in. <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=''>   I was very impressed also w/ the stock SE suspension in how it handled very fast turns (downhill of camber turns at 70-80mph) and also blasting down the front straight at 125mph ::no governor  <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=''> ::  then going around the kink at 125mph non-the-less.  She never felt like she was out of her element hell I don't know why I didn't do this sooner <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='???'>  <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=''> __________________ '91 hatch w/ SR Sold; '03 Evo Sold 401 HP; '03 MS Protege sold; '00 Evo 6.5 TME Sold 300HP

11-11-2002, 02:50 PM	#22
Dark Zilvia Member Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Arlington, VA Posts: 165 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	Thanks Adey for the feedback. I'm already looking into the smaller steering wheel and new TC rods will be a definite. Right now I just want to improve feedback from my car and these two mods should do the job (I don't have a lot to spend right now). Next on my list would be a VLSD and sub-frame spacers. My priority at the moment is to bring the car back to shape once that is done then the rest should be easy. Now I realize that the VR-4, S500 and 740IL are all great cars in their own way but none of them cost me three grand to acquire. The 240sx is a great car I love it for what it is. A fun, cheap and reliable sports car that being said my question to you is if you had the chance to drive a 911 Turbo, Modena or Vanquish would you? I had a chance to drive a S500 and I jumped on it. There are some things that I liked about it others I wasn't too fond of but in the end it was a fun experience. The reason I bought my 240SX was to improve my driving ability and I think it's a great car for doing that. I've been driving for four years now. I've learned a whole lot but if I want to improve even more then the next obvious step is autocross. For now all I want to do is Improve feel and become comfortable with my car. <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=''> __________________ 93 Fastback, 5spd with obx shortshifter Power is in the control of strength.