Staggered Setup: Pros and Cons - Zilvia.net Forums | Nissan 240SX (Silvia) and Z (Fairlady) Car Forum

Adikt · 02-23-2005, 02:54 PM

I'm using my tax refund to buy some new rims for my s14. Now should i stagger the sizes of the rims or keep all 4 the same size. I plan on autocrossing alot this season and want the best setup. I'd really appreciate your help in deciding.

orion::S14 · 02-23-2005, 04:31 PM

There's a lot more info we need to help you with this decision:

S14 SE or base model (base has no rear anti-roll bar)???

Which suspension?

Do you have aftermarket anti-roll bars?

- - - - -

I used to prefer no stagger...and I had 17X9 with 245s on all 4 corners. Found that with Tein HEs and Whiteline sway bars, there was too much oversteer, particulalry in transitions (slaloms, etc...).

I tried different swaybar adjustments, different tire pressure, camber adjustments, etc...mostly to no avail.

Then I tried stock rear anti-roll bar...and that helped..a lot.

But to finish it off, I went with 235 front tires and 255 rears...and now the car seems to be set up *perfect*...nice and neutral.

But this was a lot of trial and error.

- - - - - - - - - -

If it's realatively stock-ish...then I would reccomend no stagger and same size tires...as you add more to the equation, that's where the answer will become "clear as mud".

- Brian

XxJaPxOxNeEs23xX · 02-23-2005, 05:23 PM

orion. wat kind of set up would u suggest for using 245s 17s all around for grip or time attack type racing. i have largus front and rear, and i can adjust all the allignments to wat i want. thanks

orion::S14 · 02-23-2005, 08:12 PM

With any of the larger rear bars, and stiffer coilovers...I would think you'll have a tendency toward oversteer. Which is FUN...but not as fast as it could be for open lapping.

I used to drive at the limit, lots of tailsliding...and it was relatively quick, but not consistent AT ALL.

I have since learned to appreciate consistency, "the racing line", a more balanced suspension setup...and have learned that bigger/stiffer is NOT always better.

Anyway, enough of my ranting...

I'm thinking that your setup will be similar to mine, and a 1" F/R stagger would be beneficial...for both wheels and tires.

I plan on a 255 F and 275 R setup with my next set of wheels, and then I'll be happy

245s all around will probably feel good, but try it someday with your stock rear swaybar and see the difference in balance, you'll be amazed.

- Brian

Adikt · 02-23-2005, 09:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by orion::S14

There's a lot more info we need to help you with this decision:

S14 SE or base model (base has no rear anti-roll bar)???

Which suspension?

Do you have aftermarket anti-roll bars?

thanks for the input so far umm my cars an s14 se so i have the stock front and rear anti rollbars with the vlsd.

Suspension wise im running d2 coilovers with 7/5 springs. i got spl rucas, tractions and toe rods in back and tension rods in front.

I plan on keeping this setup except gettin stiffer springs for the coilovers something along the lines of a 9/5 setup

orion::S14 · 02-24-2005, 01:25 PM

Since the stock S14 has a tendency toward oversteer, I think that you will benefit from a non-staggered setup...with the 7/5 rates, it'll probably be pretty balanced.

As for stiffer springs....remember, stifffer isn't alwayts better. Unless you switch to r-compound tires, I'll bet 7/5 is plenty stiff, and will handle great with good street tires.

But, every drivers prefers something a little different...

...and the other advantgae of a non-staggered setup..you can rotate F to R! It'll get you another 1000 miles out of a set of tires!

- Brian

XxJaPxOxNeEs23xX · 02-24-2005, 04:19 PM

o yeh jsut to tell you tho i have stock ka, so i dont really think ill have the power to slide 245s too well, nd right now my front brakes are horrible so thats another reason i cant get it to oversteer. i dont want it too but i have major understeer right now.

brainfood · 02-24-2005, 04:29 PM

Well this is what I run, 16x7.5fr 16x8.5rr I run either 205/50-16's all the way around on the street or 205/50/16's front and 225/45/16's rear for the track. I tried running 205's all the way around at the last drift event and hated it. I like lots of throttle and higher speeds so the 205's didnt have enough grip and would spin alot the best setup I had for that day ended up being 225 michelin pilot sports on the back so they had massive grip but where so easy to control during drift with lots of throttle. Now on the street and canyon driving I have plenty of grip with the 205's all the way around and right now I am running 350z stock wheels with 225/45/17 pilot sports and the car is very well balanced. I think I prefer a staggered setup but the extra tire up front really helps with hard braking on the street on the track I have plenty of braking power since there are no real panic stops. to sum it all up for drifting and autox/circuit I prefer 205/225 staggered setup for the street I like the 225/225 setup. My friend runs 225/245 on stock ka and he likes it but I dont its too much tire I like to be able to slide the car I drive quicker that way with small angle slides on corner exit. Also with the kaaz the car has sooo much more grip than with the vlsd making even 205's grip really well in higher speed corners. My setup is kei office xr's, battle version tension rods/ruca's, stock se sways and a kaaz 2way. I love the way my car handels if is very predictable and super fun at the edge. Also have z brakes so the extra tire helds to avoid abs engagement or lock up when I pull the fuse.

XxJaPxOxNeEs23xX · 02-24-2005, 05:02 PM

damn it i already ordered rims 17 by 9 all around.
nd i was going to order 245s all around but i guess its not so good. watever im gonna try it nd see for my self haha.

speeddreamz · 02-24-2005, 05:55 PM

mb try doing 245, 255 , or 235 255 but it may look kinda funny. those sizes will fit, but might look funny. 235/ 255 seems to be a very good setup because the s14 oversteers. I've had 205 size tires all around with sways/struts/coilovers and a differential and the thing just begs to be sideways.

orion::S14 · 02-24-2005, 08:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by XxJaPxOxNeEs23xX

damn it i already ordered rims 17 by 9 all around.
nd i was going to order 245s all around but i guess its not so good. watever im gonna try it nd see for my self haha.

I'm running 17X9 (+25) on all 4, with 235 F and 255R..looks good, fits fine.

Maybe try the 245s all around first, and if you don;t like it, go wider in the rear next year when you buy tires again!

- Brian

02-23-2005, 02:54 PM	#1
Adikt Zilvia Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Chicago Age: 38 Posts: 278 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	Staggered Setup: Pros and Cons I'm using my tax refund to buy some new rims for my s14. Now should i stagger the sizes of the rims or keep all 4 the same size. I plan on autocrossing alot this season and want the best setup. I'd really appreciate your help in deciding.

02-23-2005, 04:31 PM	#2
orion::S14 Nissanaholic! Join Date: May 2003 Location: Orange Park, FL Posts: 1,666 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	There's a lot more info we need to help you with this decision: S14 SE or base model (base has no rear anti-roll bar)??? Which suspension? Do you have aftermarket anti-roll bars? - - - - - I used to prefer no stagger...and I had 17X9 with 245s on all 4 corners. Found that with Tein HEs and Whiteline sway bars, there was too much oversteer, particulalry in transitions (slaloms, etc...). I tried different swaybar adjustments, different tire pressure, camber adjustments, etc...mostly to no avail. Then I tried stock rear anti-roll bar...and that helped..a lot. But to finish it off, I went with 235 front tires and 255 rears...and now the car seems to be set up perfect...nice and neutral. But this was a lot of trial and error. - - - - - - - - - - If it's realatively stock-ish...then I would reccomend no stagger and same size tires...as you add more to the equation, that's where the answer will become "clear as mud". - Brian __________________ www.KA24DEvelopment.com

02-23-2005, 08:12 PM	#4
orion::S14 Nissanaholic! Join Date: May 2003 Location: Orange Park, FL Posts: 1,666 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	With any of the larger rear bars, and stiffer coilovers...I would think you'll have a tendency toward oversteer. Which is FUN...but not as fast as it could be for open lapping. I used to drive at the limit, lots of tailsliding...and it was relatively quick, but not consistent AT ALL. I have since learned to appreciate consistency, "the racing line", a more balanced suspension setup...and have learned that bigger/stiffer is NOT always better. Anyway, enough of my ranting... I'm thinking that your setup will be similar to mine, and a 1" F/R stagger would be beneficial...for both wheels and tires. I plan on a 255 F and 275 R setup with my next set of wheels, and then I'll be happy 245s all around will probably feel good, but try it someday with your stock rear swaybar and see the difference in balance, you'll be amazed. - Brian __________________ www.KA24DEvelopment.com

02-24-2005, 01:25 PM	#6
orion::S14 Nissanaholic! Join Date: May 2003 Location: Orange Park, FL Posts: 1,666 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	Since the stock S14 has a tendency toward oversteer, I think that you will benefit from a non-staggered setup...with the 7/5 rates, it'll probably be pretty balanced. As for stiffer springs....remember, stifffer isn't alwayts better. Unless you switch to r-compound tires, I'll bet 7/5 is plenty stiff, and will handle great with good street tires. But, every drivers prefers something a little different... ...and the other advantgae of a non-staggered setup..you can rotate F to R! It'll get you another 1000 miles out of a set of tires! - Brian __________________ www.KA24DEvelopment.com

02-23-2005, 05:23 PM	#3
XxJaPxOxNeEs23xX Zilvia Junkie Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: california Posts: 572 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	orion. wat kind of set up would u suggest for using 245s 17s all around for grip or time attack type racing. i have largus front and rear, and i can adjust all the allignments to wat i want. thanks

02-24-2005, 04:19 PM	#7
XxJaPxOxNeEs23xX Zilvia Junkie Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: california Posts: 572 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	o yeh jsut to tell you tho i have stock ka, so i dont really think ill have the power to slide 245s too well, nd right now my front brakes are horrible so thats another reason i cant get it to oversteer. i dont want it too but i have major understeer right now.

02-24-2005, 04:29 PM	#8
brainfood Post Whore! Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Eagle Rock, CA Age: 42 Posts: 2,957 Trader Rating: (18) Feedback Score: 18 reviews	Well this is what I run, 16x7.5fr 16x8.5rr I run either 205/50-16's all the way around on the street or 205/50/16's front and 225/45/16's rear for the track. I tried running 205's all the way around at the last drift event and hated it. I like lots of throttle and higher speeds so the 205's didnt have enough grip and would spin alot the best setup I had for that day ended up being 225 michelin pilot sports on the back so they had massive grip but where so easy to control during drift with lots of throttle. Now on the street and canyon driving I have plenty of grip with the 205's all the way around and right now I am running 350z stock wheels with 225/45/17 pilot sports and the car is very well balanced. I think I prefer a staggered setup but the extra tire up front really helps with hard braking on the street on the track I have plenty of braking power since there are no real panic stops. to sum it all up for drifting and autox/circuit I prefer 205/225 staggered setup for the street I like the 225/225 setup. My friend runs 225/245 on stock ka and he likes it but I dont its too much tire I like to be able to slide the car I drive quicker that way with small angle slides on corner exit. Also with the kaaz the car has sooo much more grip than with the vlsd making even 205's grip really well in higher speed corners. My setup is kei office xr's, battle version tension rods/ruca's, stock se sways and a kaaz 2way. I love the way my car handels if is very predictable and super fun at the edge. Also have z brakes so the extra tire helds to avoid abs engagement or lock up when I pull the fuse.

02-24-2005, 05:02 PM	#9
XxJaPxOxNeEs23xX Zilvia Junkie Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: california Posts: 572 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	damn it i already ordered rims 17 by 9 all around. nd i was going to order 245s all around but i guess its not so good. watever im gonna try it nd see for my self haha.

02-24-2005, 05:55 PM	#10
speeddreamz Zilvia FREAK! Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: San Francisco, California Age: 40 Posts: 1,015 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	mb try doing 245, 255 , or 235 255 but it may look kinda funny. those sizes will fit, but might look funny. 235/ 255 seems to be a very good setup because the s14 oversteers. I've had 205 size tires all around with sways/struts/coilovers and a differential and the thing just begs to be sideways.