Revmatching and double clutching

[Natty]

I just started to revmatch on downshifts, without double clutching. I am slow, but I plan on doing it alot so I will get better. I can tell it is smoother when I get it right. After I get good, I will try doing it while double clutching &nbsp;<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/hehe.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':hehe:'>

Anyone else revmatch and/or double clutch in their 240?
Do it on the track or just to practice on the street?

I am trying it to save my 150,000 mile synchros &nbsp;<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/sly.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':sly:'> What about you guys?

Jeff

[Jeff240sx]

Yeah, I do it. Not it my car, cuz its an auto for about a month more, but all my friend's cars and my grandfathers car, I always rev-match. I think its better on syncros, the clutch disk, and more importantly, my girlfriend's neck.
-Jeff

Edit: &nbsp;I DONT double clutch.

[AceInHole]

i'm one of the silly people who rev matches and doesn't use the clutch half the time.

[tnord]

double clutching on a street car? c'mon........it's just not necessary, that's what synchro's are for are they not???

[AceInHole]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (tnord @ April 15 2002,1:41)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">double clutching on a street car? c'mon........it's just not necessary, that's what synchro's are for are they not???</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
yeah, we all know TNord granny shifts.

[240meowth]

double clutching.../<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='???'>??///<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='???'>///....

yah... sure... we all double clutch don't we?... to save our synchros.... &nbsp;naa, i'm just being sarcastic, but yah, i don't see the point of double clutching unless it's for our know "3rd" gear problem...

[tnord]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (AceInHole @ April 17 2002,11:42)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (tnord @ April 15 2002,1:41)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">double clutching on a street car? c'mon........it's just not necessary, that's what synchro's are for are they not???</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
yeah, we all know TNord granny shifts.</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
around here we tends to know a few things.......and one of the things we knows is.........it's not if you have a turbo under your hood........it's if that turbo works
RICE BOY <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/hehe.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':hehe:'>

[240sBoMex]

ooohh, so revmatching is actually Good for the car? i mean better than normal shifting?? <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/eh.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':eh:'>

[AceInHole]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (tnord @ April 15 2002,2:01)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (AceInHole @ April 17 2002,11:42)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (tnord @ April 15 2002,1:41)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">double clutching on a street car? c'mon........it's just not necessary, that's what synchro's are for are they not???</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
yeah, we all know TNord granny shifts.</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
around here we tends to know a few things.......and one of the things we knows is.........it's not if you have a turbo under your hood........it's if that turbo works
RICE BOY <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/hehe.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':hehe:'></td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
"it's better to have nonworking turbo, than no turbo at all"
- confusedus

[William]

I tried to not use my clutch at all for a couple of days except for 1st and reverse, it worked. &nbsp;On upshifts (except on full throttle acceleration) all you have to do is let the revs drop &nbsp;little bit and then shift, you'll figure it out. &nbsp;I even learned how do do a 3rd gear downshift at 60mph without using the clutch, fun.

[HippoSleek]

Hey, this is not the F&F question I expected! &nbsp;:thumbup:

I always rev matched (at one time, I owned a crash box tranny) but I never double clutch. &nbsp;There is NO NEED to double clutch when driving a car with syncros and street gears. &nbsp;Besides, comparing the cost of repairing syncros to two clutches (since you are using it twice as often)... I don't think you would be saving anything even if you were perfect.

[DuffMan]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (HippoSleek @ April 16 2002,3:22)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Hey, this is not the F&F question I expected! &nbsp;:thumbup:

I always rev matched (at one time, I owned a crash box tranny) but I never double clutch. &nbsp;There is NO NEED to double clutch when driving a car with syncros and street gears. &nbsp;Besides, comparing the cost of repairing syncros to two clutches (since you are using it twice as often)... I don't think you would be saving anything even if you were perfect.</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='???'>?

How do you wear down your clutch shifting into neutral?

I usually double clutch when downshifting, but thats in part because my clutch engage position is so inconsistant.

[Natty]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (DuffMan @ April 15 2002,4:30)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (HippoSleek @ April 16 2002,3:22)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Hey, this is not the F&F question I expected! :thumbup:

I always rev matched (at one time, I owned a crash box tranny) but I never double clutch. There is NO NEED to double clutch when driving a car with syncros and street gears. Besides, comparing the cost of repairing syncros to two clutches (since you are using it twice as often)... I don't think you would be saving anything even if you were perfect.</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='???'>?

How do you wear down your clutch shifting into neutral?

I usually double clutch when downshifting, but thats in part because my clutch engage position is so inconsistant.</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
Maybe it hurts the throwout bearing and not the clutch &nbsp;<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/eh.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':eh:'>

Like I said, I don't double clutch. I just brought that up because when I was reading about revmatching, it suggested double clutching as well. I tried not to relate it to F&F too &nbsp;<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/sly.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':sly:'>

Alot of people say it is only for the track and doing it on the street is only good practice. I agree, but it really makes it nice for my passengers and hopefully my synchros. I dunno if it helps the clutch though &nbsp;<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/huh.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':huh:'>

Jeff

[HippoSleek]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (DuffMan @ April 16 2002,3:30)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"><img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='???'>?

How do you wear down your clutch shifting into neutral?

I usually double clutch when downshifting, but thats in part because my clutch engage position is so inconsistant.</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
doubleclutch &nbsp;<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/sad.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=''>
doubleclutch &nbsp;<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/sly.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':sly:'>
doubleclutch &nbsp;<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/hmmm.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':hmmm:'>
DOUBLEclutch <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/mad.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':angry:'>
"use twice" clutch &nbsp;<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/sneaky.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='issed:'>

<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/hehe.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':hehe:'> &nbsp; <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=''> &nbsp; <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/hehe.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':hehe:'> &nbsp; <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=''> &nbsp; <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=''>

[DuffMan]

Yeah clutch once as you shift into neutral, clutch again as you shift into gear.

It's only going to get worn down when you are shifting into a gear, not shifting out or into neutral. Unless you are talking about M/C S/C wear but thats not a big deal.

I think most clutch wear occurs when starting anyways.

[DrDubbleB]

I was under the impression that in order to make it good for your syncros, then you had to double clutch as well, not just rev match. &nbsp;I always rev matched, but I have only just begun to double clutch. &nbsp;It actually makes my driving a little bit more aggressive, and I seem to be able to take corners faster than before. &nbsp;And yeah, the clutch really shouldn't wear down taking the car out of gear...that would be like saying that if you press it in while it's in neutral, it will wear down the clutch.

[DSC]

Natty, I don't think allowing your synchros to do their job is really going to hurt them (unless they are already damaged). Really the only reason to revmatch is to be able to downshift quickly w/out upsetting traction.
If you haven't already read THIS article on heal-toe downshifting/double-clutching. Thats how I learned how to do it.

Edit: DrB, some people actually do say that, when the clutch is depressed its compressing the clutch spring, thus makeing it weaker and some BS like that <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=''>

[meowthsdaddy]

if you're worried about your throwout bearing, by a metal one to replace stock plastic. &nbsp;problem is gone.

[BlackFox]

Rev Match....... &nbsp;<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/sly.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':sly:'> &nbsp;I don't have the need to rev my engine while slowing for a turn, I just tap my gas to rev match before I let the clutch off when exiting a turn. I get more control that way, especially since I'm driving a crappy 89 Celica ST in the mountains. 240 in 2 weeks &nbsp;<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=''> &nbsp;can't wait, i'll put up picts when i get it.

[bbp]

Rev-matching or Heel and Toe does not neccesarily save your sycros, they still stop the gear from turn at a different rate. &nbsp;It is a good practice that will make you a smoother driver. &nbsp;Just remember the motor was not designed to be used as a brake to slow the car down, thats what the brakes are for. &nbsp;It is easier to practice when slowing quickly, 4th,3rd, 2nd, like an exit ramp, than in traffic. &nbsp;The article DSC mentioned is very good!

Use smooth, even braking while blipping the throttle for each downshift, then when stopped put the gear in neutral, your foot on the dead pedal, and your hand on your sweetie's inner thigh and try to get some till the light changes! <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/hehe.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':hehe:'>

[AJ]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (bbp @ April 15 2002,10:14)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">and your hand on your sweetie's inner thigh and try to get some till the light changes! <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/hehe.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':hehe:'></td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
ahhh memories... lol, u had me laughin out load with that one.. keep'm come'n

[adey]

I double clutch into 1st (pretty much only when entering curbs) only because I absolutely have to. I double clutch into second on my VW because of the infamous 2nd gear grind... but on the 240 I've found H&T to be enough... i.e. the synchros aren't that bad for me to need to double clutch. <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=''>

The only other I d/c is when I'm dropping gears to go faster as opposed to slowing down. -- eg when going on a freeway "run"... Good stuff to know, but not necessary.

[Broadwayblues]

That's a great site, learned a lot! thanks