Nismo suspension Q's

[Nismo180]

Just wondering if anyone has any info on the "S-tune" spring/shock combo for the S13. All I've been able to find out about it really is that Nismo makes it, it's at least springs and shocks, but might include a few other bits (I.E. Nismo Shock isolator bushings) Just hoping someone has a bit more info for me than that before I make my decision.

Disclaimer: I know everyone here and their mother thinks I should get some hardcore race only coil-overs but the fact of the matter is the 240 is my daily, I drive it EVERYWHERE it's already been halfway across the country and back twice. I'm looking for something comfortable, but a little lower, little more aggresive, little sportier. Not much else a more fun street car is what I'm looking for. I also already know that you think I should use "S-techs and KYBs" or "T3H RSRs PWN teh Nismo's" Look, I'm considering a few ideas but, like the name implies I'm a Nismo whore and I've already tried a number of combos, I'm not set in stone on the Nismo's just if their worth the money it's probably what I'll get.

Okay, think that should avoid any useless opinion posts, now on with the show!

[drift freaq]

Nismo shocks are made by KYB, I am not sure about the valving.
There are actually some entry coilover combo's that are not hardcore race. The advantages are the fact that the springs and the dampners on the coilovers have been matched by the manufacturer. JIC has a entry level setup. Tein has a entry level setup . Tanabe has one. Look around. True Nismo has matched the springs to the shocks for the S tune. I would wonder how expensive they are though. If they cost $600-700 you might as well get some entry level coilovers. Mind you I am not saying hardcore race coilovers.

[Banzai81]

Nismo S-tune suspension is a popular upgrade in Europe espacially UK and has great opinions. I'll be soon getting it for my s14 Kouki too. They are perfect compromise between daily driving and sport and you don't have to deal with any camber and allignment corrections after installing them. If you don't want to adjust the height of your car like with the entry-level coilovers, just go for the S-tune.

[Nismo180]

Originally Posted by Banzai81

Nismo S-tune suspension is a popular upgrade in Europe espacially UK and has great opinions. I'll be soon getting it for my s14 Kouki too. They are perfect compromise between daily driving and sport and you don't have to deal with any camber and allignment corrections after installing them. If you don't want to adjust the height of your car like with the entry-level coilovers, just go for the S-tune.

Thank you, that's alot of what I was looking for, now if only I could find a technical sheet on the actual spring rates I'd be a happy man.

drift/OptionZero-point well taken on the entry level coilovers, and some of them probably would be just about right, but with this car I really see extra adjustability as just another thing to go wrong. Besides, you add in height adjustability and all of a sudden I'm going lower than I really should just because it handles better down there, I'm getting the damn thing corner balanced and race alligned everytime I decided to go to an event. I just want a plug and play suspension for once. But, yeah not too shabby an idea. And, of course an alignment after any majoy suspension work, but when adding height adjustables it'd be downright counter productive to not have it cornerweighted.

[OptionZero]

It's probably good to get an alignment after *any* change in ride height.

Coilovers, like DF said, have matched spring rates to the valving of the strut. That alone means better ride quality than a spring/shock. Any of the ones he mentioned, JIC, Tein, Tanabe, would not be rough on the street (as a side note, if any of those are too rough for you, it's time for a different car...)

[OptionZero]

You don't need to get it corner weighted it if you're not going to track the car.

No offense, but it seems like you're locking yourself into a more limited selection because of personal lack of self-control.

Height adjustability is a feature you are not obligated to abuse, nor does it require you to run super low (assuming you have coilovers that allow you to retain some height). You determine the use of the parts, not vice versa. They don't adjust themselves.

[krustindumm]

Originally Posted by OptionZero

You don't need to get it corner weighted it if you're not going to track the car.

No offense, but it seems like you're locking yourself into a more limited selection because of personal lack of self-control.

Height adjustability is a feature you are not obligated to abuse, nor does it require you to run super low (assuming you have coilovers that allow you to retain some height). You determine the use of the parts, not vice versa. They don't adjust themselves.

well, he asked about the Nismo's, if you didn't have any personal experience you probably should have just closed the window. :ghey:

I'll see if i can find anything on the nissan network about them.

[Nismo180]

Originally Posted by OptionZero

You don't need to get it corner weighted it if you're not going to track the car.

No offense, but it seems like you're locking yourself into a more limited selection because of personal lack of self-control.

Height adjustability is a feature you are not obligated to abuse, nor does it require you to run super low (assuming you have coilovers that allow you to retain some height). You determine the use of the parts, not vice versa. They don't adjust themselves.

I could see alot of drama unfolded in this thread regardless of my disclaimer, but I suppose it was unavoidable. Anyway, not corner weighting a car with variable height adjsutments is like not checking piston ring gap before throwing them in. A set of coilovers that "look" right, but aren't actually at their proper riding height because no one bothered to tune them right can be unpredictable and handle mush worse than any stock setup. Also, even entry level coilo-overs will be designed to have optimum dampening in a stroke much shorter and lower than stock. After many years working with and driving high performace cars I just couldn't bring myself to throw on a peice of equipment like that and not use it to it's full advantage.

This as opposed to some of my old cars and my upcoming 240Z project is a daily driven street car that has to make it up driveways and over cobblestone roads without massaging my ass numb. I am going for a "factory performance" kind of ride, the very reason I'm so into Nismo. Their mods seem to maintain day to day livabilty with factory reliabilty and yet still a certain level of performance you can't just buy in a car. The reason I asked for spring rates is because I've done some weight adjustments, and want to make sure the spring rates would reflect that. And, 296, and 218.4 sounds like fun to me.

Drift Freaq - I'd argue with you that Nismo's intentions with their less race oriented mods is one of a factory performance veiw point. They want the cars to perform better without any large sacrifices. Higher durometer bushings will make a difference, but you also won't risk suspension bind, or feel every single little lump. yeah, there are stiffer motor mounts but the Nismo's won't shake your teeth out. Just a more relaxed aproach to tuning, but their isn't much interest out there for a faster yet still cofortable 240sx, at least not as much as there is for the 350Z

[drift freaq]

Originally Posted by Nismo180

snip happens......
Drift Freaq - I'd argue with you that Nismo's intentions with their less race oriented mods is one of a factory performance veiw point. They want the cars to perform better without any large sacrifices. Higher durometer bushings will make a difference, but you also won't risk suspension bind, or feel every single little lump. yeah, there are stiffer motor mounts but the Nismo's won't shake your teeth out. Just a more relaxed aproach to tuning, but their isn't much interest out there for a faster yet still cofortable 240sx, at least not as much as there is for the 350Z

Actually you missed the facts point of my post. Nismo Japan aka the company that sells and manufacturers Nismo stuff is not part of Nissan motor corporation. They are a seperate Indepandent entity. They are very much a pro Nissan organisation that works alongside Nissan yet Nissan and Nismo are Independant of each other. Nismo U.S.A. is the old Nissan/Datsun competition department. At the time 240sx's were first sold in the U.S. Nissan was dropping factory support of U.S. racing programs . Nissan also was afraid to really push the 240sx to its full potential here for fear of it overshadowing the 300zx which is why it did not come with a SR20det here. That is way you do not see much performance parts here for the 240sx.
Oh doubt that last little fact? Nissan acted in a simialar fashion in the past in 1970, when they killed the Fairlady 2000 Roadster, for fear it would affect 240z's.
In Japan, like I said before , The products were developed early. At the time they were developed a lot of the products you guys take for granted today were not being marketed i.e. pillowball tension rods, Advanced Coilovers etc... .Yes Nismo developed the early stuff to improve factory performance.
Remember the years were 88-90. The hotter parts started showing up a couple years after the cars were out. I do feel Nismo made a few adjustments, but like I said before ,left the more sosphicated suspension stuff for our cars to the Major Aftermarket suspension companies.
P.S.
You need to do more research in the engine mount department. Take a wander over to the Group buy section. We manufacturer and sell a High Durometer Urethane engine mount that is not only better than the Nismo's but does not rattle your teeth hahahhahhaha . Read the testamonials from all the people who have bought them.

[Banzai81]

Originally Posted by Nismo180

I could see alot of drama unfolded in this thread regardless of my disclaimer, but I suppose it was unavoidable. Anyway, not corner weighting a car with variable height adjsutments is like not checking piston ring gap before throwing them in. A set of coilovers that "look" right, but aren't actually at their proper riding height because no one bothered to tune them right can be unpredictable and handle mush worse than any stock setup. Also, even entry level coilo-overs will be designed to have optimum dampening in a stroke much shorter and lower than stock. After many years working with and driving high performace cars I just couldn't bring myself to throw on a peice of equipment like that and not use it to it's full advantage.

This as opposed to some of my old cars and my upcoming 240Z project is a daily driven street car that has to make it up driveways and over cobblestone roads without massaging my ass numb. I am going for a "factory performance" kind of ride, the very reason I'm so into Nismo. Their mods seem to maintain day to day livabilty with factory reliabilty and yet still a certain level of performance you can't just buy in a car. The reason I asked for spring rates is because I've done some weight adjustments, and want to make sure the spring rates would reflect that. And, 296, and 218.4 sounds like fun to me.

Drift Freaq - I'd argue with you that Nismo's intentions with their less race oriented mods is one of a factory performance veiw point. They want the cars to perform better without any large sacrifices. Higher durometer bushings will make a difference, but you also won't risk suspension bind, or feel every single little lump. yeah, there are stiffer motor mounts but the Nismo's won't shake your teeth out. Just a more relaxed aproach to tuning, but their isn't much interest out there for a faster yet still cofortable 240sx, at least not as much as there is for the 350Z

That IS exactly my point. I've been thinking for a long time about which suspension to go with (entry level coilover or Nismo S-tune) and I decided to go with Nismo becouse of few reasons. First, my car is a daily driver (no drifting, no autocrossing, OCCASIONAL trips to tracks like Nurburgring etc.) so I don't need any kind of adjustments for my suspension. Secondly, the roads in my country are in very poor condition so coilover suspensions don't keep their settings for longer than a week on this roads (you have to set everything from scratch). And I know that coilover that is set up wrong is worse than a standard suspension in terms of driving. This is another thing why I don't need any kind of height- dampening- camber- etc. adjustments becouse everything will be screwed up after few days anyway.
Nismo S-tune AFAIK, is the only non-adjustable suspension on the market for s14 which springs and shocks were matched to work together. It's been proved to be solid (for so many years), it's perfectly compromised between daily driving and sport and it drops the car so little (30mm front, 15mm rear) that you don't have to worry about camber corrections etc. or city driving. It's a hassle free plug and play unit.
Sorry but in my case I don't see ANY pros for buying a coilover setup and any cons of buying the S-tune.

[OptionZero]

He mentioned coilovers and he sounded uncertain of the Nismos aside from the fact he wants that brand name. Besides, I didn't flame him at all, and he didn't complain about any insight i tried to share.

I'm sorry YOU feel that my reply to HIM wasn't up to your standards.

[krustindumm]

Originally Posted by OptionZero

He mentioned coilovers and he sounded uncertain of the Nismos aside from the fact he wants that brand name. Besides, I didn't flame him at all, and he didn't complain about any insight i tried to share.

I'm sorry YOU feel that my reply to HIM wasn't up to your standards.

he asked for information, not your worthless opinion. Before you can say your opinion is not worthless, yes, it is. You have had no experience with the nismo kit, and thus can not compare it to anything or provide any technical info on it.

NNA net had nothing of value. My current NISMO catalog lists Eibach Sport kit springs (1.4", part number 99996-41063), Eibach Pro kit (1.8"/1.6", part number 54000-63101). For struts it lists only rears, Koni twin tube low pressure (part number 99996-1081S). It also lists the strut insulators (number 54320-RS520). There are some misc. other parts, none relating to a S-tune kit.

more info:
phone: 9am-4pm PST, M-F, 310-538-2610
email: [email protected]

you can order those parts at any nissan dealer.

[EchoOfSilence]

It seems that Nismo doesn't like to give away their info very much.
and it seems that it's hurt their sales because of it; they're not popular in the US

[EchoOfSilence]

nm, you should have used the search function.

Nismo S-Tune (not height adjustable)
_ _ _Front: 5.3 kg/mm | 296 lb/in
_ _ _Rear: 3.9 kg/mm | 218.4 lb/in

Nismo N1
_ _ _Front: 8/10/12 kg/mm | 448 - 672 lb/in
_ _ _Rear: 8 kg/mm | 448 lb/in


wow, that's actually stiffer than I thought they would be. Too bad they're not height-adjustable, I would consider getting this combo when my last shock blows. Any idea on how much these cost yet?
__________________

AND there's no damper adjustability. Well I guess that's what you want though, right (at least for now)? Plug and play...

[OptionZero]

I didn't give an opinion. I gave FACTS: coilovers have matched springs and shocks and can offer just as good a ride, or better, as a spring/shock combo, NISMO or not.

Given that you haven't ridden on or installed, or even seen these, I don't see how your "help" is much more valuable, so we can both toil in our "uselessness", can't we?

[krustindumm]

Originally Posted by OptionZero

I didn't give an opinion. I gave FACTS: coilovers have matched springs and shocks and can offer just as good a ride, or better, as a spring/shock combo, NISMO or not.

Given that you haven't ridden on or installed, or even seen these, I don't see how your "help" is much more valuable, so we can both toil in our "uselessness", can't we?

If they are sold as a matched set, they are matched. I provided contact info for Nismo USA, as well as all current info published by Nismo regarding S13 struts/springs.

[drift freaq]

ok guys, I will give some insight here. Having dealt with a lot of imported used stuff I have not seen the S tune products come through more than once or twice at best. Fact is the other brands have shown up on many clips. Reason? Nismo's suspension for the S13 tends to be from the very early days of the car i.e. CA18det powered cars circa 88-90. If you know anything about the Japanese aftermarket for our cars there are hundreds of products , spring strut combos and coilovers from a lot of companies. This kinda of competition kinda led to Nismo not really concerning themselves with anything more than they have done. Unless your looking for a either a mild street performance setup or a non adjustable higher spring rate track setup your pretty limited by their selection. Nismo U.S.A. is what used to be Datsun competition department and turned into Nissan Motorsports before Nissan decided to let it become Nismo U.S.A. There actually is infighting between Nismo Japan and Nismo U.S.A. . This is for two reasons. 1. Nismo Japan feels they represent Nismo and remember Nismo is a seperate entitity from Nissan motor corp Japan. 2. They did not want Nismo U.S.A. to become Nismo U.S.A. even though the Datsun competition department existed long before Nismo Japan was created. Datsun comp goes back to the 1970's. That said Nismo Japan begrudgingly allows Nismo U.S.A. to sell their products hence you not seeing everything Nismo Japan sells in the Nismo catalog available at your dealerships. On top of that a lot of the dealerships can't be bothered with selling Nismo stuff to begin with . Hence no information knowledge. That is way you see eibach and Koni but not alot of info on the S Tune stuff.
Thats the history behind this.
Krustin, Option has valid points here. Most spring shock combo's have not been tested and matched. Its a fact. A few companies do do that. Nismo probably did with the S Tune because it would be in their style. Though I would not look at this suspension being anything more than a 15-20% better than stock setup .
Nismo's engine mounts are better but not the best, there bushing replacements are not of a Urethane or Pillowball type but a slight highly durometer rubber. Why because a lot of the parts they are marketing for our cars are very early designs like I said earlier and they see no reason to try and compete when there are so many other manufacturers making products. They sell these products for the driver that wants something a little better but does not or is afraid to take the leap into real performance setups . This last part is my opinion.
Now getting back to the original post question. This is how it is. I understand how you feel and what your trying to go for. You combine your desire with a little lack of research about some of the stuff your talking about, but your asking which is good.
Fact, Having height adjustability does not mean you need to corner wieght your car. Like option said most people only corner weight cars with a lot a suspension and when the plan on tracking the car.
The reason I mention entry level coilovers for our cars for you, is the same reason Option did. Most all spring strut combo's offered for our cars here in the states have not been matched , which translates to not the most optimum ride i.e. bouncy. With a entry level coilover you get the matched setup with ride height adjustability, which you may possibly find you would like to have down the road.
I state my original comment again, for the price of what the S tune probably cost, you will quite possibly save money getting a entry level coilover setup.

[Omarius Maximus]

You can get the nismo setup for less than 700 bucks if you look. I think it's exactly what your looking for. The nismo spring shock anti swaybar combo would make an awesome daily driver. Nismo anti sways are a bit harder to find for a decent price.

If the dude doesn't want adjustable ride height, then why are you people recommending coilovers?

[Romeyo07]

I was looking into Nismo's suspension, but was swayed by a friend who tried them and hated it. Maybe I should find out for myself, or go with one that is more recommended.