need inputs - Zilvia.net Forums | Nissan 240SX (Silvia) and Z (Fairlady) Car Forum

Bbandit · 10-28-2002, 10:24 AM

yes i've read and learn from a lot of websites already. and i also listen to professionals tips at the course..
but yesterday (3rd autoX this semester),
i messed up pretty bad at the slaloms
the course was about 1.1 mil. it has 4 hairpin turns, 3 really long slaloms, and other stuff..
oh yea and it was raining so the course was a bit wet.
i can handle the turns and stuff..
but when it comes to the slaloms.. i screwed up.. whether i almost lost it or spun out and lost a lot of time! (&$*#&^&#036<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='

'>
can you autoX guys give me any tips on doing a good slaloms?
i know i have to be close to the cones...
well i did the drawing to clear things up
here's what i did..
i got it the first couple of cones.. after that.. the rear end begins to break loose... and it begins to break loose even more as i passed more cones..

where did i go wrong?

*LanceS13* · 10-28-2002, 10:36 AM

HA HA  nice drawing!!!  It shows exactly what you did wrong.
Pushing and releasing the throttle like that upsets the balance of the car...eventually it'll spin you.  The ideal way to take a slolam with cones at constant distance (ie. all cones are 80ft. apart) is to brake going into the slolam down to the speed at which  you can take the rest of the slolam.  It'll take a time or two to figure out this speed, but once you do, brake down to it and use part throttle to stay there until you can throttle out of the last cone.  Use as little throttle modulation as possible to keep the car balanced.  
Now varying distance slolams (ie. 40ft. between first cones, 60 ft. between middle cones, 80ft. between last cones or some variation) will require some throttle modulation/application/lifting.  In this case, just make any changes in throttle application as smooth as you possibly can.

Natty · 10-28-2002, 10:39 AM

My first auto-x is next weekend, so I don't really know what I am talking about. But, I think you should stay on the gas if you get oversteer. Keeps traction. Left foot brake if you have to keep your speed down.
But it was wet, so if you managed to finish,you did good <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/thumbs-up.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':thumbsup:'>
Jeff

Bbandit · 10-28-2002, 10:54 AM

yea i should have pushed the throttle constantly...
well its not like i totally release the throttle... but maybe coz its wet.. made the tires loose grip easily..
but still...
i ran ssm, my best time was 117.xxx (i have to slow down since there was some fallen cones on the course) while the fastest guy yesterday ran 111.xxx and the slowest guy ran 140.xxx
oh well..
hope the fourth autoX next november wont be a wet one..
thanks for the inputs guys
<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/thumbs-up.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':thumbsup:'>

*LanceS13* · 10-28-2002, 10:56 AM

Natty brings up a good point.  If you intend to use it, start practicing tecniques like left foot braking and heel-toe downshifting early on in your motorsports "career" (for lack of a better word).  Trying to learn them later is analogous to braking an old habit.  Left foot braking can also help in slolams and other places once you learn how to use it and the throttle to balance the car and/or induce under/over-steer.  
And take full advantage of wet conditions...wet or otherwise slippery surfaces amplify mistakes.  Use it to figure out what you're doing wrong and then figure out how to do it right.

HippoSleek · 10-28-2002, 11:47 AM

By and large, this is one you are going to have to just learn by feel - but smooth is fast.

Looking at your diagram, there is one thing I can tell you - pick a throttle position and KEEP IT! <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/cool.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='

'>

Being smooth on the gas will keep the car more settled and allow you to take more controlable speed through the slalom. I'm guessing that the end came around a bit more w/ each gate until you finally lost it when trying to close the radius. Basically a really slow snap spin.

*edit* It took me 1.5 hours to reply so Lance beat me to it.**

As for the left foot braking - I'm against that for a rwd car.  Personally, I think you get enough input with a lift and it is smother (i.e., easier to work one pedal than two).  Fwd is a different story.  Otherwise, what they said.   <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/withstupid.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':withstupid:'>

*LanceS13* · 10-28-2002, 12:02 PM

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (HippoSleek @ Oct. 28 2002,12:47)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">As for the left foot braking - I'm against that for a rwd car. Personally, I think you get enough input with a lift and it is smother (i.e., easier to work one pedal than two). Fwd is a different story. Otherwise, what they said. <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/withstupid.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':withstupid:'></td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
Yeah...I believe left foot braking is entirely personal preference. I do it b/c I was taught to (by an old racer that pilots a RWD--ITS 280Z and FSP GT-6, so it's applicable) and b/c it came really naturally to me...so it works for me and I like it. Others may not like it so much.

gabossie · 10-28-2002, 05:44 PM

I tried to learn left foot breaking but I just couldn't do it. For some reason, I am really uncoordinated in my left foot so it was either no brake or all break...kind of dangereous. Fortunately, I am really good at heel toe. <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/alien.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':alien:'>

*LanceS13* · 10-28-2002, 07:04 PM

Coordination definitely helps.  A little ambidexterity couldn't hurt either.   I think it came to me so easily b/c I've been playing drum sets for the past 10 years...where all four limbs have to move with almost equal dexterity.  <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='

'>

Bbandit · 10-28-2002, 10:07 PM

maybe i played gran turismo too much...
hard habit to let go though... especially if you have the steering wheel and the gas pedal joystick to play gran turismo with...

Tyler Durdan · 10-28-2002, 11:56 PM

We were talking about saloms at my last autocross, and some of the older guys were mentioning something about every foot away from the cone as your passing is equal to an extra tenth of a second on total time.  I kinda of believe it because on my fourth run, I got as close as I could to the cones at the fastest speed (accidently took the third one with me), but took almost four tenths off my best time.  Except the penalty for knocking the cone over meant it wasn't my best time.  When I say as close as I could, I was hitting the side base of the cones with my front tires.

Does this sound right to anyone else 1 foot = tenth of a second?

Bbandit · 10-29-2002, 12:49 AM

i know that it would be best if you stay close to the cone at slaloms but i never heard of that tenth of a sec every foot...
but yes if you stay close to the cone, you'll get a faster time (if you dont messed up at any other turns)

10-28-2002, 10:24 AM	#1
Bbandit Post Whore! Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Texas and now Jakarta Age: 43 Posts: 2,674 Trader Rating: (0) Rides Gallery: Bbandit Feedback Score: 0 reviews	yes i've read and learn from a lot of websites already. and i also listen to professionals tips at the course.. but yesterday (3rd autoX this semester), i messed up pretty bad at the slaloms the course was about 1.1 mil. it has 4 hairpin turns, 3 really long slaloms, and other stuff.. oh yea and it was raining so the course was a bit wet. i can handle the turns and stuff.. but when it comes to the slaloms.. i screwed up.. whether i almost lost it or spun out and lost a lot of time! (&$#&^&#036<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=''> can you autoX guys give me any tips on doing a good slaloms? i know i have to be close to the cones... well i did the drawing to clear things up here's what i did.. i got it the first couple of cones.. after that.. the rear end begins to break loose... and it begins to break loose even more as i passed more cones.. where did i go wrong? __________________ ==>>TGL GARAGE<<==.. RIP! S13 coupe KA-T @ 0.5 Bar = SOLD! A31 Cefiro + SR = Current*

10-28-2002, 10:36 AM	#2
LanceS13 AutoX Junkie Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: MS Age: 43 Posts: 2,044 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	HA HA  nice drawing!!!  It shows exactly what you did wrong. Pushing and releasing the throttle like that upsets the balance of the car...eventually it'll spin you.  The ideal way to take a slolam with cones at constant distance (ie. all cones are 80ft. apart) is to brake going into the slolam down to the speed at which  you can take the rest of the slolam.  It'll take a time or two to figure out this speed, but once you do, brake down to it and use part throttle to stay there until you can throttle out of the last cone.  Use as little throttle modulation as possible to keep the car balanced.   Now varying distance slolams (ie. 40ft. between first cones, 60 ft. between middle cones, 80ft. between last cones or some variation) will require some throttle modulation/application/lifting.  In this case, just make any changes in throttle application as smooth as you possibly can. __________________ 1992 240SX Fastback #47 DSP MS SCCA RX-7 ITS Project FOR SALE

10-28-2002, 10:39 AM	#3
Natty Zilvia Addict Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Nashville, TN Posts: 944 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	My first auto-x is next weekend, so I don't really know what I am talking about. But, I think you should stay on the gas if you get oversteer. Keeps traction. Left foot brake if you have to keep your speed down. But it was wet, so if you managed to finish,you did good <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/thumbs-up.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':thumbsup:'> Jeff __________________ 1991 White 240sx Fastback LE, rusty spoiler, weak driveshaft, exhaust rattle.... Rattles are just your cars way of saying 'I love you.'

10-28-2002, 10:54 AM	#4
Bbandit Post Whore! Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Texas and now Jakarta Age: 43 Posts: 2,674 Trader Rating: (0) Rides Gallery: Bbandit Feedback Score: 0 reviews	yea i should have pushed the throttle constantly... well its not like i totally release the throttle... but maybe coz its wet.. made the tires loose grip easily.. but still... i ran ssm, my best time was 117.xxx (i have to slow down since there was some fallen cones on the course) while the fastest guy yesterday ran 111.xxx and the slowest guy ran 140.xxx oh well.. hope the fourth autoX next november wont be a wet one.. thanks for the inputs guys <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/thumbs-up.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':thumbsup:'> __________________ ==>>TGL GARAGE<<==.. RIP! S13 coupe KA-T @ 0.5 Bar = SOLD! A31 Cefiro + SR = Current

10-28-2002, 10:56 AM	#5
LanceS13 AutoX Junkie Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: MS Age: 43 Posts: 2,044 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	Natty brings up a good point.  If you intend to use it, start practicing tecniques like left foot braking and heel-toe downshifting early on in your motorsports "career" (for lack of a better word).  Trying to learn them later is analogous to braking an old habit.  Left foot braking can also help in slolams and other places once you learn how to use it and the throttle to balance the car and/or induce under/over-steer.   And take full advantage of wet conditions...wet or otherwise slippery surfaces amplify mistakes.  Use it to figure out what you're doing wrong and then figure out how to do it right. __________________ 1992 240SX Fastback #47 DSP MS SCCA RX-7 ITS Project FOR SALE

10-28-2002, 11:47 AM	#6
HippoSleek Nissanaholic! Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: elsewhere Posts: 2,081 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	By and large, this is one you are going to have to just learn by feel - but smooth is fast. Looking at your diagram, there is one thing I can tell you - pick a throttle position and KEEP IT! <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/cool.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=''> Being smooth on the gas will keep the car more settled and allow you to take more controlable speed through the slalom. I'm guessing that the end came around a bit more w/ each gate until you finally lost it when trying to close the radius. Basically a really slow snap spin. edit It took me 1.5 hours to reply so Lance beat me to it.** As for the left foot braking - I'm against that for a rwd car.  Personally, I think you get enough input with a lift and it is smother (i.e., easier to work one pedal than two).  Fwd is a different story.  Otherwise, what they said.   <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/withstupid.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':withstupid:'>

10-28-2002, 12:02 PM	#7
LanceS13 AutoX Junkie Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: MS Age: 43 Posts: 2,044 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (HippoSleek @ Oct. 28 2002,12:47)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">As for the left foot braking - I'm against that for a rwd car. Personally, I think you get enough input with a lift and it is smother (i.e., easier to work one pedal than two). Fwd is a different story. Otherwise, what they said. <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/withstupid.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':withstupid:'></td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'> Yeah...I believe left foot braking is entirely personal preference. I do it b/c I was taught to (by an old racer that pilots a RWD--ITS 280Z and FSP GT-6, so it's applicable) and b/c it came really naturally to me...so it works for me and I like it. Others may not like it so much. __________________ 1992 240SX Fastback #47 DSP MS SCCA RX-7 ITS Project FOR SALE

10-28-2002, 07:04 PM	#9
LanceS13 AutoX Junkie Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: MS Age: 43 Posts: 2,044 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	Coordination definitely helps.  A little ambidexterity couldn't hurt either.   I think it came to me so easily b/c I've been playing drum sets for the past 10 years...where all four limbs have to move with almost equal dexterity.  <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=''> __________________ 1992 240SX Fastback #47 DSP MS SCCA RX-7 ITS Project FOR SALE

10-28-2002, 10:07 PM	#10
Bbandit Post Whore! Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Texas and now Jakarta Age: 43 Posts: 2,674 Trader Rating: (0) Rides Gallery: Bbandit Feedback Score: 0 reviews	maybe i played gran turismo too much... hard habit to let go though... especially if you have the steering wheel and the gas pedal joystick to play gran turismo with... __________________ ==>>TGL GARAGE<<==.. RIP! S13 coupe KA-T @ 0.5 Bar = SOLD! A31 Cefiro + SR = Current

10-28-2002, 11:56 PM	#11
Tyler Durdan Zilvia Junkie Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Don't mess with Texas Posts: 546 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	We were talking about saloms at my last autocross, and some of the older guys were mentioning something about every foot away from the cone as your passing is equal to an extra tenth of a second on total time.  I kinda of believe it because on my fourth run, I got as close as I could to the cones at the fastest speed (accidently took the third one with me), but took almost four tenths off my best time.  Except the penalty for knocking the cone over meant it wasn't my best time.  When I say as close as I could, I was hitting the side base of the cones with my front tires. Does this sound right to anyone else 1 foot = tenth of a second? __________________ "Pure adrenaline attached to a license plate.  Isn't it time to experience one yourself?"                           -Dan Gurney Turbo for Sale

10-29-2002, 12:49 AM	#12
Bbandit Post Whore! Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Texas and now Jakarta Age: 43 Posts: 2,674 Trader Rating: (0) Rides Gallery: Bbandit Feedback Score: 0 reviews	i know that it would be best if you stay close to the cone at slaloms but i never heard of that tenth of a sec every foot... but yes if you stay close to the cone, you'll get a faster time (if you dont messed up at any other turns) __________________ ==>>TGL GARAGE<<==.. RIP! S13 coupe KA-T @ 0.5 Bar = SOLD! A31 Cefiro + SR = Current