SRT-4. Cool car, but what the hell!?

[chokudoriS13]

Originally Posted by old_s13

Basically it works like this:

anything that shows heritage, good taste, innovation, and dedication is great in my book.

Unfortunately, there's really not much "made in the America" that I care about. So, it doesnt matter if its a Dodge Viper or a Dodge Neon SRT-4.. they just dont do it for me.

Not saying that the Dodge Viper isnt a great car, I think its okay.. but I know there are other cars that are just better.. and have a better history.. and are made by companies that dont suck as much. And well, thats where I like to leave things.

If you're going to support companies, dont support ones that suck. If you are going to buy a car, dont buy ones that suck. The 240SX doesnt suck. NISSAN doesnt suck. Dodge, sucks. They make cars like the Dodge Dart. They make cars like the Dodge Aries. They make cars like the Dodge Neon. Then they make higher performance cars like the Dodge Neon SRT4. Great, its better.. it can compete. BUT, it still sucks.

- Mike

I guess all this time I've been giving you much more credit than you deserve. I'm sorry... I guess I'll take it back now. Your replies are incredibly rice-boy-like and are a polar opposite of how any real automotive enthusiast would reply. You absolutely deny that a very capable and affordable car is any good because of the badge it wears. You refuse to accept the facts Ryan (AKA) is providing. Quit being a badge snob and actually read his posts before blindly replying... Maybe you'll learn something.


You're right, Dodge is crap! Piles of crap! Crush them all!






Nissans rule! Lets make every race car a Nissan... They're amazing. Praise them!

[chokudoriS13]

Originally Posted by darithS

They're pretty fast for drag racing, sucks for anything else.

WHAT??!!?!?!?! Put down that Super Street mag!

[gsracer]

just a stupid thought....

so if we were all having this conversation say 15 years from now, and there is still a neon srt 4 that has slowly evovled along the way to be a little better than it is now, things would be different because of heritage.

I completely disagree, you must remember cars like the 240sx or z or skyline, or a corvette , or camaro , or mustang, didnt just appear from nowhere they all had a first.

Keep in mind that i HATE the NEON, i think its an econobox with a big turbo engine. It has a squishy brake pedal, vague shifter at best, it looks horridly ugly from almost any angle, BUT i respect it for what it is, an evolution in our market, a fast car offered to us, import enthuisiast, just like the evos and sti's (except no where nearly as good) also just as the camaros and chargers and the horspower wars of the 60's, they were built for the enthuisiast. The only difference in the neon, to the rest of us is that mopar went more to its heritage of straight line racing than drifting/autox most of us like.

i still hate it though, but there is a measure of respect in my hate

JUST A STUPID THOUGH

[old_s13]

its not about the badge it wears.. you can take off the badges and i'de still hate it -- its about the manufacturer that makes it. i dont like dodge.. and unless we're talking OLD domestics, there's really no point because I dont like anything NEW from the domestic mfg's. Most of the newer domestic cars absolutely SUCK compared to the OLD domestic cars -- this is SO ovbious, hence the reason SO many people respect old american muscle cars.. and well, where are the NEW Impala enthusiasts? If anything, the Mustang still has some tradition.. but personally I cant see myself owning a nice Mustang when there are MILLIONS of them on the road AND they sell bottom of the barrel 6-cylinder convertibles that come in yellow with white tops and are driven by HIGHSCHOOL GIRLS. Please.. get a sense of individuality and drive something that ISNT so damn excessively worn and torn.

I think you helped change my mind though with those pictures, I REALLY want a Dodge now. I think all my friends who have owned American cars didnt FULLY convince me until now when YOU posted those pics. My friend with the Dodge Omni Turbo? Ah yes.. sweet memories.. what an AMAZING car that was. To this day, I still recall ALL the problems that car had. But yes, it sure did go fast.. in a straight line... when of course, it ran.

My friends with Mitsubishi Eclipses.. great cars.. every one of them. They rock. Of course, WHEN THEY RUN.. amazing how there is ALWAYS something wrong with those cars.

Say what you want, but for me.. its NISSANs that get the constant whip and rarely give car problems in my book. Toyota too, one of my friends put his Supra through HELL and it was amazing how long that car lasted. Honda? Great company. BMW? I hate German but they SURE know how to build cars.. they can be excessively engineered but I wont talk too bad about them, they are still very solid cars.

VW/Audi = Crap
Dodge = Crap
Ford = Crap
Mercedes? YAWN.

Why cant people have preferences in things they buy? Since when does someone have to RESPECT Dodge? Fuck yeah I'm narrow minded, we all are in some shape or form. For me, its all about building quality cars while keeping history and heritage alive.

Saying that Dodge is a respectable company is like telling me Jessica Simpson is a great music artist -- and she can act too! whoopdeedoo! Lemme go buy Christina Aguilera and Brittany, support all the suckers who are trying hard to make something out of themselves! Why bother? There are better, more talented artists trying to make it who dont come with all the pop-pizazz-and egotistical attitude based on stupidity.

Dodge and Ford are great for one thing in my book -- they know how to mass produce cars that are daily driven by millions of government institutions who lease massive amounts of cars for their employees. People need cars? Ford and Dodge supply them. Enterprise Rentals rents out cars, DODGE NEON. Its cheap and its a rental. Just like MacDonalds.. you want to eat for 1 dollar? Come on in....

[DRFT]

yes dodge sucks, thus the chager that blew up in F&F ahha

[gsracer]

old_s13

i agree with you, dodge sucks new domestic cars suck and although well engineered, german cars suck. "I" respect the SRT-4 for what it is, a pretty fast engine in a shit wrapper, and no "I or you" may not like it but some people do, and thats ok, and its also ok to have a prefrence, shit i would never ever by a frigin dodge, unless it was a truck to pull my race car.

What my question really was though is how can i car have heritage if it just came out, when the 240sx , charger , skyline etc first came out there was no heritage for them, we have the luxury of existing now, when they have been around for years.

Granted for the past say 15 - 20 years dodge has not had that good of a reputation, is that the basis for your heritage argument or is it something else.

Not trying to contradict you or anything just enjoying a good discusion on this forum.

[Var]

The SRT-4 (forget about dodge) is a step in the RIGHT direction...Think about it this way.

We all want cars that cater to our needs, so in the past 5 years or so, there have been cars coming out that offer good performance in different areas for a good price. So the SRT-4 appeals to the drag racers. Ya it handles ok..but it has buttloads of power. It out accelerates the 350z and the Porsche Boxster S. for 20 grand, a lot of teenagers in the drag scene will jump on the opportunity to buy this car. Now this isn't for us. I agree. I wouldnt buy this car, but i agree with everything it stands for. No frills(has no power windows in the rear lol[that's lovely])
The only bells and whistles are turbo noises
Not that ugly IMO
It's a car built for a purpose.


I see this as a pioneer in a new style of cars. Inexpensive cars with high performace..sure maybe it has shitty interior, shitty looks..but who cares. The next step is to build a car for another demographic(correct usage?) Who will take the initiative to build a car that will meet our criteria

1-Japanese!!
2-Lightweight(2800 lbs or less)
3-Good balance
4- Front Engine RWD
5-250 or so horsepower preferrably turbo
6-Decent styling
7-Factory LSD
8-And to follow Dodge's footsteps..*affordable* aftermarket parts that are still under warranty.

[hookedup240]

IMO its not all about power, a car has to look good too. Which the srt-4 doesn't. Its ugly as hell and fwd. Have you ever seen these cars at the strip, they spin all the way through 2nd and into 3rd.

O well its faster than a Z and cheaper(not on a highway run though), but its still ugly, doesn't handle as good and doesn't have the CLASS the Z has, and has the build of a dodge, which by my experiences have shown me that it is crap.

I have driven a lot of cars having worked at a car auction place so i have a good idea of what kind of quality these cars have compared to others. And they suck.

Again its not all about speed and going fast in a straight line.

[Var]

you dont listen

[gsracer]

Originally Posted by westboroughpimp

you dont listen

i must have said at least three times in my endless ramblings that the srt4 is not made to handle, it was built to go as fast as possible in a str8t line, turning left or right are not its strong suits, stock anyway.

it still sucks.

[Var]

i'll quote myself to drill it into people's heads.

We all want cars that cater to our needs, so in the past 5 years or so, there have been cars coming out that offer good performance in different areas for a good price.So the SRT-4 appeals to the drag racers. Ya it handles ok..but it has buttloads of power. It out accelerates the 350z and the Porsche Boxster S. for 20 grand, a lot of teenagers in the drag scene will jump on the opportunity to buy this car. Now this isn't for us. I agree. I wouldnt buy this car, but i agree with everything it stands for. No frills(has no power windows in the rear lol[that's lovely])
The only bells and whistles are turbo noises
Not that ugly IMO
It's a car built for a purpose.


I see this as a pioneer in a new style of cars. Inexpensive cars with high performace..sure maybe it has shitty interior, shitty looks..but who cares. The next step is to build a car for another demographic(correct usage?) Who will take the initiative to build a car that will meet our criteria

[tsunami0ne]

There's no point in arguing. Nobody from either side will listen.

[Jeff240sx]

Any of you seen/ridden in a '04? I'm a really good driver, and punched it in the SRT-4, got a chirp going into 2nd. And the last 300rpm of 1st the tires broke loose. I've seen '03s going down the track spinning away.. but I really think that the addition of the torsen differential to the '04 (stock) helped with traction problems. I didn't go flying around corners like my s14, but it was still surefooted as long as I didn't give it gas around the corner.
Footnotes: Rember the torsen lsd that's stock in '04. Not as much tire spinning and handles nicely going 60 around 25mph corners.
-Jeff

[gsracer]

Originally Posted by tsunami0ne

There's no point in arguing. Nobody from either side will listen.

were not arguing were discussing, :ghey:

[AKADriver]

Originally Posted by tsunami0ne

There's no point in arguing. Nobody from either side will listen.

Well, that's just the thing.

I'll listen to anything. There are plenty of reasons to not like this car. It's not comfortable, the looks are totally love-it-or-hate-it, you can gripe all day about the feel of the controls or the factory paint color options or the way the turbine housing is integrated with the exhaust manifold. The wheels are narrow, the curb weight is high (400lb over a standard Neon), the wing cuts into rear visibility, if you order side airbags you get shitty base model Neon seats.

But no. People have to make up imagined faults like bad handling, flagrant lack of safety, lack of "heritage", it keeck my dog and now my dog needs operation, etc.

[Jeff240sx]

Originally Posted by AKADriver

The wheels are narrow, the curb weight is high (400lb over a standard Neon), the wing cuts into rear visibility, if you order side airbags you get shitty base model Neon seats.

The wing has been griped about in every review I've read. But my, 5'9" and a friend 6'4" and the owner 6'0" all only have the top .5"-.75" of rear-viewing removed by the wing. Its not something I'd complain about. The curb weight is high.. but it's a larger motor, turbo stuffs in it, ect. It also has 18" wheels stock, and they're not narrow.. 225mm iirc. That's wider than stock 240sx tires.
I agree with imagined problems.. but I really think that quoting off magazine reviews without actually sitting in the car yourself is stupid. The above problems don't seem to make sense to me.
-Jeff

[sykikchimp]

Originally Posted by AKADriver

it keeck my dog and now my dog needs operation, etc.

BAHAHAHAA.. Stupid Dog!

I hate the SRT-4 for the same reason I don't like all those old dodges you posted. Those hideous cars are all faster than my beautiful 240sx, and shouldn't be. I know my car is better in every way, except.. arrgg. WHY OH WHY DID NISSAN SCREW US WITH SUCH PATHETIC ENGINE OUTPUT?!?! I'm jealous of their power, and can only take solice in my cars sweet cornering serenity. I need a hug.

I think I'm going to swap an SRT-4 engine into my 240.

Ok.. enough Drama.

Ryan - aren't you tired of being the lone Neon supporter on every forum your on? I respect your passion.

[AKADriver]

Nah, I do it for fun. Remember, I SOLD my Neon. hahaha. Not that I wouldn't buy another, and I would have if this Civic didn't come up.

Jeff, the wheels are 17x6JJ with 205/50-17. That's narrow! 225s will fit in the wheelwells, though, but just barely. They should have flared the fenders, IMO.

[darithS]

Originally Posted by chokudoriS13

WHAT??!!?!?!?! Put down that Super Street mag!

so.. im just hating lol

[old_s13]

aka> People have to make up imagined faults like bad handling, flagrant lack of safety, lack of "heritage", it keeck my dog and now my dog needs operation, etc.

I didnt make stuff up, i went to the NHTSA web site and simply said how an old_s13 scores BETTER in the crash ratings than a NEW_NEON, thats all. Its not made up, its truth.


gsracer> its also ok to have a prefrence, shit i would never ever by a frigin dodge, unless it was a truck to pull my race car.

Most definately, I dont think I'de ever buy a Japanese truck.. thats for sure. Americans know how to make one thing, and thats trucks for hauling shit.

[hookedup240]

Originally Posted by old_s13

aka> People have to make up imagined faults like bad handling, flagrant lack of safety, lack of "heritage", it keeck my dog and now my dog needs operation, etc.

I didnt make stuff up, i went to the NHTSA web site and simply said how an old_s13 scores BETTER in the crash ratings than a NEW_NEON, thats all. Its not made up, its truth.


gsracer> its also ok to have a prefrence, shit i would never ever by a frigin dodge, unless it was a truck to pull my race car.

Most definately, I dont think I'de ever buy a Japanese truck.. thats for sure. Americans know how to make one thing, and thats trucks for hauling shit.

Actually the titan is badass, i'd get that, in motor trend they rated the titan higher than the f series.

[AKADriver]

Originally Posted by old_s13

I didnt make stuff up, i went to the NHTSA web site and simply said how an old_s13 scores BETTER in the crash ratings than a NEW_NEON, thats all. Its not made up, its truth.

You didn't make that up, the guy that said "hey I heard people who drive Neons all crash and die, but I don't feel like looking up any facts" - HE was making stuff up.

Yeah, it does get mid-pack safety scores. Nothing new there. But there isn't a rusty ice pick sticking out of the steering wheel.

[240KAT]

I'm going to to have to back Mike up on this one. I don't see the big deal behind the SRT-4. Its a domestic 1.8T w/ a little more balls. It's a teenage girls car turned 'sports car'. The reason i put sports car in quotes is because its still a teenage girls car. Its still a Jetta/Neon, just with some guts. My dad had a 1.8T and then bought an E36. Hmm..'sports car' to Sports Car. Unless a given car goes through some serious re-doing, the 'performance model' won't ever get my acclaimation. I think that's what Mike is trying to say. Example: MSP=yawn...MSM=fun.

[hookedup240]

Originally Posted by 240KAT

I'm going to to have to back Mike up on this one. I don't see the big deal behind the SRT-4. Its a domestic 1.8T w/ a little more balls. It's a teenage girls car turned 'sports car'. The reason i put sports car in quotes is because its still a teenage girls car. Its still a Jetta/Neon, just with some guts. My dad had a 1.8T and then bought an E36. Hmm..'sports car' to Sports Car. Unless a given car goes through some serious re-doing, the 'performance model' won't ever get my acclaimation. I think that's what Mike is trying to say. Example: MSP=yawn...MSM=fun.

I actually think its a 2.4L

[zero.counter]

Originally Posted by hookedup240

I actually think its a 2.4L

It is . . .

[MakotoS13]

look, i believe that the only kinds of sports cars are RWD 2 doors (and RX8's). sr20powered S13's are king of the litter, in my opinion. i don't plan on EVER buying another FWD vehicle again (had a cougar) and will NEVER buy another FWD performance car... cause it's so limited. now, with that said:

i noticed a couple things reading this thread. first people ripped on it being a neon, writing it off as a basic run of the mill crap fest. then it was the handling. THEN the brakes. then the SAFETY? what the hell?

first of all, yeah, it's a dodge so don't expect quality control to be fantastic. hell, ever see a viper interior? secondly, the handling is well above par. anyone that knows anything about these cars knows that their chief asset (prior to the stock turbo days) was the handling. finally, the brakes. sport compact car tested them pretty well and deemed well suited for their purpose. four piston calipers on a sub 2700lb car with 240hp? the frickin maxima doesn't have that. hell, does the 350Z have 4 piston calipers?

yeah, they put a really great motor on a nimble chassis with decent brakes. they souped up a neon, get over it. put a SR20 i your 240 and be happy with a car that can run with the big boys in full street trim.

to borrow a tactic from choku:

yeah, domestic cars nowadays blow


even when heritage is maintained


even if they are supercars


especially when they outperform ferrari enzos...

[240KAT]

Originally Posted by hookedup240

I actually think its a 2.4L

I was saying its like a 1.8T in the sense that its an econocar -turn- sports car..not that it was a 1.8L

[MakotoS13]

Originally Posted by 240KAT

I was saying its like a 1.8T in the sense that its an econocar -turn- sports car..not that it was a 1.8L

it isn't nor will ever be a sports car no matter how fast it is. the audi TT is a 1.8L right? it's hardly an econobox.

[AKADriver]

haha, the Audi TT is VERY econobox. They put curvy body panels on a Golf/Jetta/GTI. Seriously. The base model Audi TT has the same 180hp 1.8t and tiptronic automatic driving the front wheels as every college girl's Jetta. The basic floorpan and suspension are the same. The VW Golf R32 selling for $30k has the same AWD system as all the TT Quattros up to the $45k 3.2 DSG - which also has the same VR6 engine as the R32.

Now, the Lotus Elise - that's a 1.8, naturally aspirated even (Toyota 2ZZ-GE) and that's definitely no economy car.

[240KAT]

There should be a smiley shaking his head..you guys missed what i was trying to say entirely. The displacement is not the subject matter. When i made a reference to the 1.8T, i was referring to the car, not saying the Neon was a 1.8L Turbo.