2011-2012 NBA Season Thread

[ALTRNTV]

It's about damn time! Kobe's knee is fully healthy according to reports.

[Gnnr]

Latest twitter updates from Adrian Wojnarowski

Age limit for NBA Draft is still on long B-list of issues (w/ drug testing, D-League assignments, others) that need to be negotiated out.

Among NBA team executives, there hasn't been a clamor to change one-and-done. In proposals, league has pushed for two years in college.

Here's a rundown on tentative labor deal points, via memo that's already being circulated to teams, players and agents for ratification.

Contract lengths: 5 years (Bird rights), 4 years (non-Bird); Escrow: 10% annual; Rookie scale: No reduction. Minimum salary: no reduction.

More deal points: Max salaries: only 1 level equal to 30% of cap. Extend and trades: Still allowed. (Good news for Dwight Howard-Chris Paul)

new exception: $2.5M for teams below salary cap to go over the cap. Those teams can't use mid-level or bi-annual exceptions.

Mid-level exception: non-taxpaying teams can use a $5M MLE for up to 4 years. Taxpaying teams have a $3M mid-level for up to 4 years.

Teams now have three days to match offer sheets given to their own restricted free agents.

Minimum team salary increases to 85% in first two years of deal and 90% in years thereafter.

Amnesty clause is in deal, just matter of form it takes. Last proposal allowed teams to use it on a current contract at anytime during CBA.

People keep asking about draft age rule: Still needs to be negotiated, but several team executives believe it will remain the one-and-done.

You won't have front office executives and basketball personnel pushing their owners to fight for change on rule. Most are fine with it.

http://twitter.com/#!/WojYahooNBA

Dis gon b gud

[Gnnr]

Odd. After the last NBA work stoppage, the Bulls and Jazz opened with an NBA finals rematch, just as Heat and Mavs will this year

http://twitter.com/#!/ByTimReynolds

Mind = blown

Well, Heat haters. You will get to watch salt get rubbed in the wound on National Television. The Mavs will get their rings and hoist the banner on opening day.....when we play them. :/ This will surely kick start the drama to the season and connect the storylines from where we left off.


Grown man soap opera....

[Phlip]

Bold Predictions:
New Orleans and Portland out of the playoffs due to the Chris Paul situation and injuries, respectively. Cripples and Timberwolves in, dependent upon how well Ricky Rubio does.

LeBron wins the MVP in a damn-near mandate.

Dallas Mavericks repeat.

Spoelstra Joins the ranks of those looking for work before I turn 33 in July.

[aziankingz]

Chris Paul better not injure himself - he has a championship to win next season with the knicks!

[Phlip]

No one said anything about Chris Paul injuring himself… what was said what that his free agency situation – and the fact that the NBA owns the Hornets – will kill their season and that the Portland Trailblazers will be done in by injury.

[Gnnr]

Ahh, feels good to be back in the swing of checking my morning NBA news. Twitter is buzzing this morning with speculation of CP3 and Howard movement. The usual suspects are in play. NY, LA, NJ, BOS.

[Phlip]

Originally Posted by Gnnr

Ahh, feels good to be back in the swing of checking my morning NBA news. Twitter is buzzing this morning with speculation of CP3 and Howard movement. The usual suspects are in play. NY, LA, NJ, BOS.

I agree, I was beginning to lose my head with the lack of basketball news

[OBEEWON]

Heard someone say Kobe.

The Herman Cain of Basketball.

[tricky_ab]

Originally Posted by Gnnr

Ahh, feels good to be back in the swing of checking my morning NBA news. Twitter is buzzing this morning with speculation of CP3 and Howard movement. The usual suspects are in play. NY, LA, NJ, BOS.

The Knicks are not getting CP3. They shouldn't even bark up that tree.

It would be like signing three top QBs to your roster.

They need a SG, they need a C, and need scoring off the bench (Sprinkle in some toughness as well).

Deandre Jordan and D12 should be the only ones the Knicks should be looking at as first targets. Crawford, Shannon Brown and others to help fill the other roles.

[OBEEWON]

That's what we do. The Nicks and the Eagles share front offices. Worst decision making in sports history.

While we are at it we gonna try and get Maubury back. I want no parts of Chris Paul.

[tricky_ab]

Originally Posted by OBEEWON

That's what we do. The Nicks and the Eagles share front offices. Worst decision making in sports history.

While we are at it we gonna try and get Maubury back. I want no parts of Chris Paul.

That last line got me, I'm not even going to front...

[ALTRNTV]

It was also said that the Knicks would not get Carmelo Anthony...

[Gnnr]

Well, here's the things working against the Knicks for getting Chris Paul.

Article by John Hollinger from ESPN

We've been hearing since the infamous wedding toast of last summer that Carmelo Anthony, Amare Stoudemire and Chris Paul want to play together for the Knicks. We're two-thirds of the way there. Melo and Amare are already Knicks, and CP can become a free agent after the season and sign with New York. Looks like a slam dunk, right?

Not so fast.

It appears the only realistic way that Paul can end up in Gotham would be if he is willing to take a massive pay cut. He would likely make about 60 percent as much in New York as he could make in New Orleans and, even in the best-case scenario, forego tens of millions of dollars compared to playing in other markets.

Let's quickly follow the salary-cap logic involved in Paul moving to the Knicks as a free agent:

• The current salary cap is at $58 million with the players taking a 51.1 percent share of BRI.

• Next year, the players' share goes down to 50 percent, likely offsetting any increase in BRI itself. In other words, one can reasonably expect next season's salary cap to be right around $58 million.

• The Knicks have $39.5 million committed just to Stoudemire and Anthony. (And before you ask, they cannot renegotiate their contracts downward.)

• Even if the Knicks got rid of everybody else and just had those two on the roster, the 10 "cap holds" for minimum salary players would occupy another $5 million in salary cap space.

• That means the Knicks have an absolute minimum of $44.5 million committed.

• Which, in turn, leaves the Knicks with an absolutely best-case scenario of a $13.5 million starting salary for Paul.

Paul will make $16.4 million this year and would be opting out of $17.7 million in 2011-12. Should he opt out next summer, a new five-year contract with the Hornets would start at $17.177 million and pay him as much as $22.3 million by the end -- a total of $98.8 million. In comparison, over the life of the maximum allowable four-year deal with the Knicks, he could get only $57.6 million.

So if Paul really wants to go to New York, he can go -- as long as he's willing to give up, at a minimum, forty million dollars to do it. (The same, incidentally, applies for Deron Williams or Dwight Howard.)

In fact, even this scenario seems optimistic as far as Paul's New York earning potential; it would basically involve New York giving away Iman Shumpert, Toney Douglas, and Landry Fields, not to mention whatever players the Knicks sign this offseason or draft next June. The Knicks would have only the "mini" mid-level and a bunch of minimum contracts to use to surround Paul, Anthony and Amare -- they'd have vastly less, in other words, than even the Heat had to work with last summer.

Should the Knicks keep Shumpert and Douglas around, New York would have just $11 million for Paul's starting salary, and the total value of the contract would be half what he could get by staying a Hornet; even compared with leaving the Hornets and signing with another team for the full maximum, he'd be leaving about $30 million on the table.

Around this point, Knicks fans will point out that a free-agent signing isn't the only way Paul can end up in New York. He could also try to force a trade, and that wouldn't be as financially damaging. Paul's potential earnings improve somewhat if he wants to do a sign-and-trade or an extend-and-trade, although they still lag behind what he can make by staying.

Alas, there's one little problem with that: The Knicks would need something worth trading. Sorry, New Yorkers, the Hornets aren't giving away their superstar for Chauncey Billups' expiring contract and Douglas. They can't even trade a draft pick, as their 2012, 2014 and 2016 first-round picks are all owed to other teams and the league forbids teams from trading picks in consecutive years. In other words, if New Orleans decides to pre-emptively trade CP to avoid losing him as a free agent, there's a zero percent chance of his landing on the Knicks to join Amare and Melo.

Moreover, if the Hornets are convinced CP is leaving, it's hard to imagine them passively waiting around for Paul to ditch them in the summer. Especially after that whole LeBron thing two summers ago.

This is why I argued the Knicks overpaid in the Anthony trade with Denver rather than being patient and signing him outright over the summer -- they have no assets left to make a deal for Paul, and yet from a financial standpoint, trading for Paul is the most realistic route to bringing him on board.

Or rather, they do have one asset if it's important enough to them: They could trade Anthony for Paul.

No matter how you slice it, it seems somewhere between highly unlikely and virtually impossible for Paul to end up with Amare and Melo on the Knicks. He can't force a trade there, he'd take a financial bath signing there as a free agent, and the Hornets aren't going to sit idly by and lose him for nothing. The CP-to-New York talk to match Miami's Big 3 makes for fun conversation for this winter, but the Knicks lost hope of this happening the day they made the Anthony trade.

Also, the NBA owns the Hornets, and it would reflect negatively on them to trade to NY after they just spent months in the lockout arguing for competitive balance. Since the Knicks have no trade assets, according to Hollinger, the most likely trade destinations for CP3 are Lakers, Clippers or Celtics. The Clippers are also in a position to get both CP3 and Howard. How 'bout that!

Carmelo and Amare took max contracts (unlike Wade/Bosh/LBJ in Miami who took pay cuts) so CP3 would have to take a massive pay cut just to fit on the team, and even then, they wont have money to fill the roster. In the new CBA you can go over the cap on rookie salaries but NOT for Vet minimum. If the plan all along was to have 3 top tier players all along, I dont understand why Amare and Carmelo didn't take less to provide cap flexibility.

One more thing on the new CBA, as far as the Amnesty Exception goes. Any player that gets amnestied, is FIRST eligible to any team under the salary cap (not the luxury tax). Whatever team under the salary cap bids the highest for that player gets the player. The player has no decision on where he goes. The team is not on the hook for whatever contract money is owed to him, only the previous team is, but the new team is on the hook for the amount of time (years) left on the contract.

If non of the teams under the salary cap bid on the amnestied player, then he becomes a free agent.

Teams under the cap: Denver Nuggets, Sacramento Kings, Indiana Pacers, Memphis Grizzlies, New Jersey Nets, Washington Wizards and New Orleans Hornets.

[Riq]

Originally Posted by AkademikONE

It was also said that the Knicks would not get Carmelo Anthony...

That is correct but you're missing an important point. Melo and Amare got max deals knowing full well that CP3 was in the works meaning they are taking 40M already. I don't see CP3 taking $10M per just to play with these guys. I bank more on a D12 and CP3 to L.A via extent and trade deals before the deadline. NY shot themselves in the foot by not mimicing what Riles did here. Does Paul want to play in NY? Yes. Is he willing to take shit money as the best pg in the game? Hell no, not when L.A is a viable option. Also remember that on top of the huge paycut he will take compared to 2 players that aren't on his level, NY taxes the shit out of these guys so Paul will be playing for peanuts on a franchise that has a coach that can't spell defense and will get them knockout early every year. Plus the most important selling point Kobe>Melo/LaLa/Amare/Dantoni/taxes and shit weather.

Edit: Paul to Boston for Rondo seems to be in the works from what I just read.

[Gnnr]

Agents may speak with teams today. No deals can be signed before Dec. 9. NBA players can use team facilities tomorrow.

In other news, two additional games have been scheduled for Christmas. So there will be a total of 5 games that day.

[Phlip]

Originally Posted by Riq

*stuff I agree with*

Edit: Paul to Boston for Rondo seems to be in the works from what I just read.

Paul was said to not want to sign long-term with Boston.
Know what? I understand too... the "big three" are about done, and while he may have a ONE year championship window, he does not have one that lasts for even the length of a long-term contract, and that SUCKS.

[Riq]

Originally Posted by Phlip

Paul was said to not want to sign long-term with Boston.
Know what? I understand too... the "big three" are about done, and while he may have a ONE year championship window, he does not have one that lasts for even the length of a long-term contract, and that SUCKS.

True I wrote that before Broussard came out to clarify CP's position. My money is on CP and D12 to L.A. NY has nothing NO wants or needs. Boston has a better chance at getting Westbrooke for Rondo at this point. The way I see it D12 is the key to what will happen with CP3.


God it feels good to talk real basketball again. This lockout hurt alot more than 98', I was in high school and chasing booty so I was too busy to miss it as much. Welcome back NBA

[ALTRNTV]

So to whichever team wins this season, will they have an asterisk by their name? I don't think so, 66-games is a pretty legit number of games and will have teams working harder instead of the usual 82-games in my opinion.

[BOROSUN]

Originally Posted by OBEEWON

That's what we do. The Nicks and the Eagles share front offices. Worst decision making in sports history.

While we are at it we gonna try and get Maubury back. I want no parts of Chris Paul.

fuck yeah, starbury > cp3!!!

[Gnnr]

Originally Posted by Riq

My money is on CP and D12 to L.A.

This.

Originally Posted by AkademikONE

So to whichever team wins this season, will they have an asterisk by their name? I don't think so, 66-games is a pretty legit number of games and will have teams working harder instead of the usual 82-games in my opinion.

I don't think the Spurs have an asterisk. I think the back-to-backs-to-backs make it a tougher season actually. Its only a 16 game difference.

[OBEEWON]

I don't watch half the season anyway. Cut the fat, straight to the meat!

[Riq]

Originally Posted by AkademikONE

So to whichever team wins this season, will they have an asterisk by their name? I don't think so, 66-games is a pretty legit number of games and will have teams working harder instead of the usual 82-games in my opinion.

The person who first brought up that idea was Phil Jackson after the Spurs won it all. There really is no reason for a championship this season to be any less than any other year. Especially when you consider all the back-back-back nights that will be played. Also to my point coaches, fans and players alike have been asking for games to be cut out of the 82 game marathon. If Stern were to listen to them 66 games per year would be right on the money. The problem is the owners are the only ones against a short season. Personally I like the 82 game season as is, I can't get enough of basketball.


In other news: I just read on Sheridan Hoops that D-Will will not be signing an extension in NJ. His agent said that due to the changes in the CBA, it wouldn't make sense for him to do so. Looks like there is a good chance he will leave.

In Heat news: If Mike Miller was going to get a shot at playing for a ring in Miami I doubt it a bit more now. Turns out Mike Miller had hernia surgery in the past few weeks and he is already out 8 weeks. I think Pat is going to give him the pinkslip now which sucks because we didn't get to see Mike playing healthy at all last season. The brightside is that this may mean Caron Butler may be wearing his #5 uni in Miami once again.

[enkei2k]

oh god...here we go...last year was melodrama, this year chrisodrama. He wants the trade.

Chris Paul requests trade to N.Y. - NBA - Yahoo! Sports

hasn't he learned anything from his friend?

fuck...as good as he is. like stated a million times, how is he going to be traded to the knicks? via 10 team trade? with what assets?

[BOROSUN]

who cares, let him be...

because...

[Riq]

Originally Posted by enkei2k

oh god...here we go...last year was melodrama, this year chrisodrama. He wants the trade.

Chris Paul requests trade to N.Y. - NBA - Yahoo! Sports

hasn't he learned anything from his friend?

fuck...as good as he is. like stated a million times, how is he going to be traded to the knicks? via 10 team trade? with what assets?

I wouldn't take that too seriously, the Hornets went on record to say they didn't get such request. Plus if Paul really wants to be a Knick he knows it won't happen through a trade unless the NBA wants to kill the Hornets soon after. There is zero upside to a trade to NY if you are NO. NY has no picks and no cap to help NO unload a shit contract or two. I stand by my CP3 and D12 to L.A prediction. Although I must admit I would love NY to land him, it would make Heat vs Knicks all the better

[BOROSUN]

its been done lux tax with scrubs before so why not with cp.
either cp does a pay cut with endorsement deals.

cp3 for 2012!

[Riq]

Originally Posted by BOROSUN

its been done lux tax with scrubs before so why not with cp.
either cp does a pay cut with endorsement deals.

cp3 for 2012!

Correct but those 3 can't pull off what the Heat did. The only one out of the 3 that would play D is CP3. On top of that CP wouldn't just take a paycut he would be the red headed stepchild of the 3 as far as money goes when he's really the best player. The only way CP ends up in NY is if L.A allows it and I don't they will. Again I would love to see it happen just for our rivalry but i'm not naive either.

[Gnnr]

Originally Posted by Riq

In Heat news: If Mike Miller was going to get a shot at playing for a ring in Miami I doubt it a bit more now. Turns out Mike Miller had hernia surgery in the past few weeks and he is already out 8 weeks. I think Pat is going to give him the pinkslip now which sucks because we didn't get to see Mike playing healthy at all last season. The brightside is that this may mean Caron Butler may be wearing his #5 uni in Miami once again.

Miller, pls go. Battier, Prince, or Butler. Riley, make it happen.

[Riq]

I just read that the Mavs wont be getting their rings on opening night. As a Heat fan I guess thats good not to watch but I really feel that watching the Mavs get their rings would have been good for our NBA finals no show LeBron. Maybe that would have snapped him out of the mental block he goes through in the 4th qtr. Oh well, I guess the raising of the championship banner and many chants of "OVER RATED" will have to do...


One more interesting thing I read about. If Pat wants to be cutthroat he can void Mike Millers contract as long as he can prove that he got hurt during D12's charity game a few weeks back. Then he can amnesty Joel Anthany and now the Heat would have enough room to sign a Battier or Butler and Samual. I like those over Glassman and Joel, although Joel played his ass off last season. But I doubt Pat would do that, it would go against what the Heat stand for but it is still interesting. I'm 99% sure Grant Hill will sign her for the Vet minimum so that would be another player to replace Mike Miller