Why do you think Zilvia.net traffic is dying fast?

[Silverbullet]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the whole Z thing was tacked on at some point I recall. Zilvia already had an S chassis community established. Zilvia did not do enough to market towards Z/G owners.

I'm willing to say most Z/G owners on here were S owners previously.

[g35gabby]

Originally Posted by Silverbullet

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the whole Z thing was tacked on at some point I recall. Zilvia already had an S chassis community established. Zilvia did not do enough to market towards Z/G owners.

I'm willing to say most Z/G owners on here were S owners previously.

It was ZILVIA in 2006, anything before that I don't know. I would assume a good majority of the Z/G owners on here are previous S chassis owners too.

[Z_Spool]

I think the delineation there was there was always a large gap between those who owned S vs Z chassis, and those who were buying Z's and especially G35's didn't so much want to associate too closely with the peasants driving $1k secretary cars. They all tended to congregate on their own boards like my350z.com The only real Z community we had here were Z32 drivers, which again was a discontinued model with diminishing popularity. Even then, I think it's safe to say most Z32 owners stuck to Nico rather than joining here.

[drift freaq]

Originally Posted by Silverbullet

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the whole Z thing was tacked on at some point I recall. Zilvia already had an S chassis community established. Zilvia did not do enough to market towards Z/G owners.

I'm willing to say most Z/G owners on here were S owners previously.

You are indeed wrong Wests original intention was to include Z's at that time there was no Z33 or Z34. There was only the Z32'and earlier ones. Both of which actually had their own forums hence why he named it Zilvia. Doubt me ask him sometime. I have been around this forum since around 6-9 months after it started. It has always been more a community of S chassis owners than Z car owners.

Fact is I have been on those other forums and on the 350z forums there is a moderate amount of discussion about engine mods and suspension mods. Of course many of you miss the fact that Z and G's came from the factory with enough power that modifying or swapping ones engine was not first order.

With S chassis is was almost a automatic situation that a S chassis owner wanted to drop a SR in. It made for a very different dynamic of owner.
There were more of the hot fodder type here. What is the hot fodder type?
We tend to take engine swaps as a given, turbocharging and Supercharging as a given and whatnot.
We also felt it was more a necessity.

It's just a fact of life though we get older our priorities change we spend ten years with a particular car and feel it's time for a change. Some moved into G's and Z's others bough other brands.
The ones that owned a S chassis as their first car sometimes got sentimental and held onto their cars or if not not the original one bought another one.
Others just moved on, the community changed.

The crack up here is the most people bemoaning the change in this thread have only been around since 2007. To me that is when the biggest change in the average S chassis owner was in full swing the last seven years have just gathered momentum down that road.

You had to have been here back in 2001-2006 to see just how really different it was.
I am not bemoaning this I am just noting it. I learned many years ago that great things have their times and then things change. Those great times become something that happened and is over.
You can get that back you can't recreate it . It's done it's over remember it fondly and move along . Create something new and different that can be great and reveal in that. New day , new chapter in the book of life.
Same shit with cars guys.

[!Zar!]

For fuck sakes, it's ZILVIA.

Z-chassis

S-chassis

Z-ilvia

[Matej]

Maybe the members are dying of old age.

[ixfxi]

Originally Posted by Z_Spool

The only real Z community we had here were Z32 drivers, which again was a discontinued model with diminishing popularity. Even then, I think it's safe to say most Z32 owners stuck to Nico rather than joining here.

I want to say that I think you are totally wrong. First, Z32 owners are some of the most enthusiastic Z owners I have ever met. I have a SHIT TON of Z32 customers who are true fanatics about their cars, they make 240SX owners look ordinary. Second, most Z-owners stick to THE ORIGINAL forum: twinturbo.net -- its the same shitty interface, but all the old schoolers still congregate there. To sum things up, the Z32 chassis is _THE_ Z-chassis. In terms of car enthusiasts, the Z33 and Z34 pale in comparison.

Originally Posted by drift freaq

I learned many years ago that great things have their times and then things change. Those great times become something that happened and is over.
You can get that back you can't recreate it . It's done it's over remember it fondly and move along .

So Dave, how was Woodstock? :-)

[Z_Spool]

Originally Posted by ixfxi

I want to say that I think you are totally wrong. First, Z32 owners are some of the most enthusiastic Z owners I have ever met. I have a SHIT TON of Z32 customers who are true fanatics about their cars, they make 240SX owners look ordinary. Second, most Z-owners stick to THE ORIGINAL forum: twinturbo.net -- its the same shitty interface, but all the old schoolers still congregate there. To sum things up, the Z32 chassis is _THE_ Z-chassis. In terms of car enthusiasts, the Z33 and Z34 pale in comparison.

Perhaps I put things into the wrong terms, what I was saying was simply that with the model being discontinued, the growth of the community has the same issue as any other car that was no longer in production. Less of them for people to get their hands on means less people joining enthusiast communities. Since I've not owned a Z32, I've had no knowledge of any of the Z-specific boards, which kind of emphasizes my point of there being a pretty definite divide. That was the point behind my reference to NICO. Either way, my point in regards to why the site isn't growing when the Z lineup is still being offered by Nissan still stands, that we've not had the Z audience because:

1. the newer generations were owned primarily by people who thought of the older Z generations and the S-chassis as beneath them and would rather commune with others who were in the same boat, where most of them still making payments on their $25K+ cars instead of an old $1k sports-commuter
2. Owners/enthusiasts of the older gen Z's stuck mostly to their own forums elsewhere as well.

And why shouldn't they? The Z32 had a greater racing pedigree, and was less likely to be picked up by a teenager who's making min. wage flipping burgers. The 240 on the other-hand had that market cornered, and with more and more of these kids filling the forums, it appears less and less desirable to join when you've already got a perfectly good place to hash out discussions of your car.

Reader's Digest Version:
Z32's didn't have a bunch of broke Zilvia kids buying them, so the owners post elsewhere. Z33's didn't have a bunch of broke Zilvia kids buying them, so the owners post elsewhere. S-chassis were bought up by a bunch of broke Zilvia kids buying them, so the owners post here.

I still don't know if I'm making a coherent point here, but it's been a long day (week) at work, so my brain's pretty well fried at this point. Add that to the post being typed out in a disjointed manner broken up by hours of working before getting back to finish typing out an incomplete thought and well... it's probably something I should have abandoned without posting long ago. That said... *click*

[MadScientist]

<----- Real Deal OG Hardcore MuthaTuckin 240 Owners... still exist!!

I'm not dead yet.
I still have my Kouki.

NOW, I know a few OGs are on here still. I did fall off for awhile, but I needed to get ME right again. In fact, I haven't touched my Kouki in nearly 2 years, and not because I don't want too! Life cost a lot when you work full time and go to school full time. I'm not some old chump taking out deferred college loans to build my car either!

What have I seen? I remember seeing the 97/98 Kouki when it first fit the dealer floors and wanting one. I remember talking to a guy pumping gas next to me in a black Kouki, then buying one a month later in 1999. Honda was all the rage. It was Rare that anyone modified their car, and the gains were so small back then. Information was word of mouth and you would be lucky to find some store with Sport Compact Car mags. Then, FnF came out. The Kouki was laughable, but to the true Enthusiast it was nice to see some respect. Then we got what all turners thought was the holly grail. D1GP... and we americanized it. Hell, a cowboy in a mustang is more well known here than Keiichi Tsuchiya. That hurts to even type! Bandwagon jumpers like a second gold rush in the west. ZILVIA ON THE RISE while 240s meet their demise!!! Things were good for a bit but it was a lot of Information age R&D. The 240 being a cheep experimental rat subject. True 240 enthusiast try to hold their values, and still do. D1GP lost interest. FnF goes hard on the CGI. Bandwagoners fall off and fine new wagons. Manufacturers backing out of the US. It looks bad, but to the True OG... its great! The Kouki is now more rare and soon approaching cult icon status. Why would I not be happy about that! Zilvia will fall into that category of followers. But this is the hard part. Right now is where things fall into the shadows and people forget. Let it happen. The phoenix will rise again.

[DRIFTER-M]

Some of the questions are answered with common sense...

- Duh the Miata forums will grow, as another poster pointed out - many more years of production, crashed cars are replaced still, more and more market for them... Obvious.

- Duh Zilvia has died off, drifting boomed hard in the late 00's thanks to FnF, n00bs came here, and the elitest society that s-chassis owners are kicked them to the curb. Regardless one's feeling on n00bs, the drifting scene handled it's growth POORLY, and since most s-chassis owners are drifting as well it kind of goes/ went hand-in-hand.

- Not zilvia's fault, but forums in general are struggling to some degree as everyone simply social media groups and the like.

I would bet that if the U.S. had the 15 year importation rule rather than 25, we will be seeing a bit more traffic on here again due to more high-end owners bringing over cleaner s-chassis, and s15s in particular. If the IDX would have materialized, the same probably would have occurred.

Whomever compares the s-chassis as we know (13,14,15) to the s12 is fooling their selves however. For an entry level sports car, it has made quite the impact in pop culture in a relatively short time. It has also been corrupted by some bad owners and hacked up work, this is true - but again, our scene/culture/whatever handled the growth poorly by making it cool to be "haggard".

Just my .02

[Future240]

^The rachet spec 240's are quit an embarrassment.

It is refreshing to see some of the old heads.

[Agamemnon]

Originally Posted by MadScientist

<----- Real Deal OG Hardcore MuthaTuckin 240 Owners... still exist!!

I'm not dead yet.
I still have my Kouki.

NOW, I know a few OGs are on here still. I did fall off for awhile, but I needed to get ME right again. In fact, I haven't touched my Kouki in nearly 2 years, and not because I don't want too! Life cost a lot when you work full time and go to school full time. I'm not some old chump taking out deferred college loans to build my car either!

What have I seen? I remember seeing the 97/98 Kouki when it first fit the dealer floors and wanting one. I remember talking to a guy pumping gas next to me in a black Kouki, then buying one a month later in 1999. Honda was all the rage. It was Rare that anyone modified their car, and the gains were so small back then. Information was word of mouth and you would be lucky to find some store with Sport Compact Car mags. Then, FnF came out. The Kouki was laughable, but to the true Enthusiast it was nice to see some respect. Then we got what all turners thought was the holly grail. D1GP... and we americanized it. Hell, a cowboy in a mustang is more well known here than Keiichi Tsuchiya. That hurts to even type! Bandwagon jumpers like a second gold rush in the west. ZILVIA ON THE RISE while 240s meet their demise!!! Things were good for a bit but it was a lot of Information age R&D. The 240 being a cheep experimental rat subject. True 240 enthusiast try to hold their values, and still do. D1GP lost interest. FnF goes hard on the CGI. Bandwagoners fall off and fine new wagons. Manufacturers backing out of the US. It looks bad, but to the True OG... its great! The Kouki is now more rare and soon approaching cult icon status. Why would I not be happy about that! Zilvia will fall into that category of followers. But this is the hard part. Right now is where things fall into the shadows and people forget. Let it happen. The phoenix will rise again.

Less talk
More RareTrick

[raz0rbladez909]

I stop by from time to time to see how the crowd is around here. I still have a good amount of love for the s-chassis, but haven't owned one since around 2010. I still renew my premie subscription because this is where I started off as an enthusiast, and I don't want to see this place disappear.

The spam has been ridiculous for quite some time now. That was probably one of the biggest reasons I stopped logging on. Go to off topic to see the page full of spam, especially first thing in the morning. In premie land we tried combatting it with a report thread, but it ended up getting old after seeing the same shit daily.

Realistically for the price of getting a 240 up to par, you can find plenty of amazing cars that will outperform even some of the more upgraded s-chassis.

[DRIFTER-M]

Originally Posted by raz0rbladez909

I stop by from time to time to see how the crowd is around here. I still have a good amount of love for the s-chassis, but haven't owned one since around 2010. I still renew my premie subscription because this is where I started off as an enthusiast, and I don't want to see this place disappear.

The spam has been ridiculous for quite some time now. That was probably one of the biggest reasons I stopped logging on. Go to off topic to see the page full of spam, especially first thing in the morning. In premie land we tried combatting it with a report thread, but it ended up getting old after seeing the same shit daily.

Realistically for the price of getting a 240 up to par, you can find plenty of amazing cars that will outperform even some of the more upgraded s-chassis.

Buy another s-chassis! Bring back ALL the old members!!!

[MadScientist]

Originally Posted by raz0rbladez909

Realistically for the price of getting a 240 up to par, you can find plenty of amazing cars that will outperform even some of the more upgraded s-chassis.

I think this has been a prime motivation. I simply want to build the car to match or exceed the intent Nissan had for it as an original concept. To beat Porsche! Yes I have driven a 993TT and its my dream car. NO, the 240sx will never compare, but I can try, even if the cost is nearly the same!

I love this place and all its flaws!

[bing]

it's been said here already but the answer is 100% facebook for 240sx forums because the drivers are younger.

vehicles with drivers 30+ years old will have decent forums but those will die off as well

more so than age though it is determined by whether or not you have a decent 9-5 job / family and need to keep FB separate from your hobbies.

[gbaby2089]

Originally Posted by bing

it's been said here already but the answer is 100% facebook for 240sx forums because the drivers are dumb.

Facebook car groups suck.

Forums forever.

[JayDM420]

Originally Posted by gbaby2089

Facebook car groups suck.

Forums forever.

I agree 100%

I have never used social media stuff so I dunno what content is on there but I find SO much info on these forums

[DRIFTER-M]

Originally Posted by JayDM420

I agree 100%

I have never used social media stuff so I dunno what content is on there but I find SO much info on these forums

Imagine modern day Zilvia, but even more obnoxious.

[Z_Spool]

pretty much the "you're doing it wrong" tread, but instead of mocking, its a circle jerk.

[xilovelsdx]

Originally Posted by DRIFTER-M

It has also been corrupted by some bad owners and hacked up work, this is true - but again, our scene/culture/whatever handled the growth poorly by making it cool to be "haggard".

Idk how that garbage missile car/ratchet biker skater kid thing has ever been cool to anyone with a brain.

[DRIFTER-M]

Originally Posted by xilovelsdx

Idk how that garbage missile car/ratchet biker skater kid thing has ever been cool to anyone with a brain.

The birth of the "missle" car @ EBISU - was kind of cool. The cars were thrashed for drifting instead of simply being crushed or junked when banged up.

The trend that many stateside adopted of simply making their cars look broken for no reason is a different story... again though, I don't have any place to tell someone how to style their car. I don't particularly like it, but I don't think the constant bashing and negativity does anything positive to help against it either.

[S14kouki805]

I'm a newcomer to Zilvia and I barely got myself an S14 a few mos. ago, it's a car I've always wanted since the late 90's when I started getting into Gran Turismo. Then life happened and I went through cars I actually needed not wanted, in 2006 I got a brand new WRX but crashed it and my insurance went through the roof so I traded it for something more "conservative". Now 15 years later I had the cash and said fuck it I'm buying the damn 240, whenever I drive it I have smile on my face, its just a basic RWD car that I can smash and bust donuts with to relieve my stress. I drive it daily and can't wait to hit a track with it.

Most people I know do not understand why I bought that car but when I run into people that know what's up I always get the props the car deserves. I really can't think of another car that I would want just for fun, everything else is too complicated or heavy, not RWD, etc. The S chassis to me is like a big toy, fuck the old hype, FnF bullshit (I always thought that movie was retarded and did no justice to imports) I always hated Hondas. Just a good lightweight RWD mildly powerful car is all you need.

And lastly a decent forum to look shit up when you get lost, even if it has a bunch of jaded assholes.

[Bushido]

Remember Freshalloy?

[SimpleS14]

Originally Posted by Bushido

Remember Freshalloy?

Oh man, it was the first forum I joined with Zilvia quickly afterwards.

With the raise of spam and further expansions for Infiniti and Nissan cars, the forum started to go downhill. It still has a good amount of historical information though.

I guess I can consider myself somewhat of an OG member since I got my S14 in 2001. I have to say that lately with social media (FB, IG, Twitter) providing easier avenues to share stories, pics and get instant gratification, this can contribute to the decline in forum activity. I prefer forums over these outlets because it's easier to search for archived information. It's actually the main reason I'm still keeping my forum around, which saw a drastic drop as more and more people went to FB.

Also as mentioned, there are fewer 240s out there that haven't been trashed. I can't speak for other OG members, but I've moved on from the 240. Nothing wrong with the car per say, it's just that I now live in a city and rarely need a car. On top of that it's difficult to work on a car if I had one. The next time I revisit getting a hobby car, which won't be for awhile, it's going to be a platform that's versatile (i.e. 4 doors).

[dorkidori_s13]

Originally Posted by xoxide

I blame everything on dorkidork, err... dorkidori

thumbs up guy, thumbs up!


and now onto the crux of the thread...

Zilvia has been in a state of decline for quite a while now, but its not JUST Zilvia... its the entire 240sx scene that has gone down hill. As a long time vendor on Zilvia and 240sx owner, Ive watched generations of kids come and go from our scene and unfortunately with each newer and younger generation, things are just getting worse and worse due to passed on mentalities, beliefs and by younger kids watching the actions of the older guys... though the flood of younger guys seems to be slowing up a bit now that these cars in decent to great condition are starting to be priced higher and higher. it seems like a lot of the missile cars are finally finding their way to the big metal heaps in the sky.

most (not all) younger kids who are flocking to the 240sx scene now are kids who only live behind their cell phone screens that know running their mouths in a negative way will never get them in trouble so they show zero respect to others they converse with. they fail to follow forum rules and instead of hunting around for posted rules, they simply use the excuse "oh i didnt see that on my cell phone"...their attention spans are excessively short, they exhibit very little respect for others, web forums to them are what "old people use" (so are computers) and theyre coming into a car scene that has been turned into "demolition derby is cool" mentality ruled by cheap, Chinese made crap parts, fly by night vendors that are only out to make a quick buck who dont care about the quality of their goods or parts (NOT ALL VENDORS as i know a few who are still around that continue to make amazing stuff) and a "disposable commodity" mentality seems to have spread like a plague... as if having a beat to shit, poorly built car is "teh winz!" because "hooning" is epic!

there are those of us who still contribute to the scene and the forums. But it seems our voices are drownwed by those who want to do nothing but talk shit and make people feel bad for asking questions. though it is annoying kids dont know how to SEARCH anymore... or utilize the small questions thread, flaming has gotten WAY too out of control. while we are ALL guilty of flaming from time to time, just the sheer level of heat anymore DOES drive people away. it use to be when people flamed others, the line "learn how to search you *insert creative name here* before you open your mouth" use to be the common fair... now searching is no longer mentioned and lines like "you should really just kill yourself" or "you should wreck and die in your 240 for asking something so stupid" are the norm and common fare.

the decline of users on Zilvia is also heavily influence by Facebook (which plays into my above paragraph). There are hundreds upon thousands of user made forums that are hosted on FB that dont require ever leaving Facebook! this is actually part of Facebook's business strategy (if you look into those sorts of things). when a user leaves Facebook to research topics or surf elsewhere on the web because it cant be found on FB, Facebook has officially failed and does not want that happening!

perhaps one day when the 240sx becomes a "restoration" style community, we will start seeing a bit of "quality" return and perhaps the added traffic from people who are older, want to return to something that made them happy in their younger years and who have the money to afford restoring their favorite car while being able to buy quality or rare parts again... but until that day comes, traffic to the site will be swayed more and more by Facebook and by people who dont want to deal with 22 year olds who think its ok to say anything and everything negative to people who happen by the site and start a new thread!

[FRpilot]

Originally Posted by dorkidori_s13

perhaps one day when the 240sx becomes a "restoration" style community, we will start seeing a bit of "quality" return and perhaps the added traffic from people who are older, want to return to something that made them happy in their younger years and who have the money to afford restoring their favorite car while being able to buy quality or rare parts again... but until that day comes, traffic to the site will be swayed more and more by Facebook and by people who dont want to deal with 22 year olds who think its ok to say anything and everything negative to people who happen by the site and start a new thread!

Agree with all you have said.. and I will come back when the "restoration" era comes. Waiting for that day...

[dorkidori_s13]

Originally Posted by FRpilot

Agree with all you have said.. and I will come back when the "restoration" era comes. Waiting for that day...

im thinking about asking the admins to allow for a "restoration only" forum for those of us who are doing just that seeing as it is becoming a "thing"

[silviasandbeer]

Well dorki, until then can we get some dedicated spam mods. Me and Falkon are down!
The spam after midnight is embarrassing

Ask an admin that instead
I say this with respectful frustration lol

Blaming facebook is a cop out when there is all these penis enlargement threads

[simmode1]

Originally Posted by silviasandbeer

Blaming facebook is a cop out when there is all these penis enlargement threads

Yeah,right? Apparently medical research is now using stem cell transplants to grow bigger tits & dicks. Who knew?