Arizona's Next Immigration Target: Children of Illegals

[kingkilburn]

If the government can justify kicking out one legal citizen they will justify kicking out any and every citizen they like.


When you are considering laws and government action like this you have to consider all possible motives and results.

When you look at this in conjunction with the new powers* proposed for the Secretary of State you get a scary picture.

*Should Hillary Have the Power to Strip You of Your Citizenship? | The Beacon

[bb4_96]

Originally Posted by kingkilburn

If the government can justify kicking out one legal citizen they will justify kicking out any and every citizen they like.


When you are considering laws and government action like this you have to consider all possible motives and results.

When you look at this in conjunction with the new powers* proposed for the Secretary of State you get a scary picture.

*Should Hillary Have the Power to Strip You of Your Citizenship? | The Beacon

A little radical maybe? I didn't read that article but as far as i know they only want to kick out a the anchor babies(that was the topic anyway) who are seen as a loophole in the system. Thats a far cry from them saying "people from northen illinois are worthless, pack your things." or "your a drain on the system, peace." Just because the federal government has the power to do something doesn't mean they will but thats obvious. Its only scary if you buy into the radical media and make very huge worst case scenario doomsday-esque assumptions.

[bb4_96]

I just read your article. The fact that your that worried about terrorists losing their citizenship frightens me. If someone is frequenting all the wrong circles and it looks like they intend harm against the US they had better lose their citizenship. Do you think that power to remove suspected terrorist's citizenship is going to sprial out of control until hundreds of thousands of average run of the mill mainstream american's are getting ousted for suspected terrorism?

As a side note I think losing citizensip should be a possible penalty for criminals. Do you want to feed them and pay for their college education in prison?

[kingkilburn]

When new laws are concerned I always think of the worst thing that can be done using them.

I don't believe that in all cases these worst case scenarios are the true intent of the law maker but often enough they are. Even when they aren't it does not mean that some one can't come along later and capitalize on it later.

[kingkilburn]

Originally Posted by bb4_96

I just read your article. The fact that your that worried about terrorists losing their citizenship frightens me. If someone is frequenting all the wrong circles and it looks like they intend harm against the US they had better lose their citizenship. Do you think that power to remove suspected terrorist's citizenship is going to sprial out of control until hundreds of thousands of average run of the mill mainstream american's are getting ousted for suspected terrorism?

As a side note I think losing citizensip should be a possible penalty for criminals. Do you want to feed them and pay for their college education in prison?

All they have to do is claim you are a terrorist and it's over for you. You no longer have any rights or protections under the constitution.

I'm not worried about true terrorists losing their citizenship.

[theicecreamdan]

McCarthyism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

McCarthyism is the political action of making accusations of disloyalty, subversion, or treason without proper regard for evidence.

What are we going to do with a bunch of "terrorists" with revoked citizenship? Send them back where they came from? I'd rather see them stay here in a prison cell than be sent back where they can get back to work.

When you lose US citizenship, what do you become? What if some country we aren't getting along with decides they want our "ex citizens" that originally came from that place to do dirty work? Do they have a legitimate claim to take them back? Wouldn't it give us more authority over how they are handled if we let (force) them keep their citizenship?

[bb4_96]

This is getting too uber radical. I'd like to see this be more realistic. I highly doubt that people are going to lose their constitutional provisions for getting a slurpee at the 7-11. You have to be doing some shady stuff to get roped into that. And if anyones running too close to those circles maybe they ought to worry about this new legislature. But 99.99999999999% of america will never have to worry about anti-terrorism laws. I think the line of thinking is if your nose is clean why worry?

[bik]

I am mexican I live in mexico and trust me, i am with arizona...

most mexicans than go to mexico dont do a lot of good to the country, no taxes, only go for money, and try to get mos of the system.

If i see here in mexico a lot of guatemala people coming and making gangs and stuff, trust me i will be as rasist as hittler.

I love USA i have visit it many times and i think USA have his right to stop and take care if they land if they want-can... we dont live in a federation like star trek yet! >_<

[Csomme]

^ Love you man <3

[D.Adams]

lol i love it when people from California cry about our laws.

[BUBS]

man shit like this makes me wish the sun would explode already -_____-

i honestly don't get how people can be so ignorant and fucked up. I think the main problem is the police. they can't seem to catch the right people. i'm sure if they stopped all the immigrant criminals there would be a lot less people bitching about the illegal immigrants that come to make an honest living because they couldn't wherever they came from.
i mean the cops did a great job at arresting me cause of a warrant made to someone who clearly wasnt me, but have no chance finding the guy who shot my sister? great job pigs..

/rant

[kingkilburn]

The problem is that the Feds don't want to make a full comprehensive plan of action to deal with immigration in general, legal or otherwise.

[bb4_96]

^ Why would they. As soon as a politician says the word Illegal and immigrant in the same sentence he looses thousands upon thousands of votes.

[kingkilburn]

Who gives a crap about votes. They have a job and they need to do it. If they do it well they will get reelected.

[bb4_96]

But then there is reality. Best case scenario somebody pulls him on board with one of the immigration reform special interest bandwagons or he sees a majority of his constituants heavily opposed to one thing or another. Then he'd be stupid to pursue the hispanic votes(unless they were the majority lol).

[kingkilburn]

Originally Posted by bb4_96

... or he sees a majority of his constituants heavily opposed to one thing or another. ...

That is the case for any and all issues. You can't please every one all of the time.

Either you sell out to the lobbyist and big business or you do what you think is the right thing.

[Walperstyle]

I think the true problem here is you guys have too many useless people that dont want to work hard for a dollar. I'm sure the ones that bring a company money, and pay taxes are the ones that will be safe. ...in any country.

second is too many of you expect the politicians to make the country work for you. Uh, JFK said you shouldnt be asking what your country should do for you, but what you should do for your country.

cheers

[bb4_96]

^can i stand on the border with a gun?

[kingkilburn]

1. You seem to be basing your ASSumption on a bs stereotype of Americans.

2. The government has all the authority on boarder security, I have none. What do you propose I do as a lone citizen to stop illegal immigration?

[bb4_96]

#2 ^ you can stand with me.

[Devius]

Having lived in california for 18 years. Immigrations something that ive gotten "used" to. And honestly. the main thing that bothers me is the fact that they migrate over. then we as native born americans, have to learn THEIR language. which is total BS to me. its not like we go over there and expect them to speak good english. Its sort of like a slap in the face. Our country is pretty much making it comfortable for illegals to immigrate over here. we may as well roll out the damn red carpet.

[theicecreamdan]

Originally Posted by Devius

the main thing that bothers me is the fact that they migrate over. then we as native born americans, have to learn THEIR language.

No we don't .

[Walperstyle]

Originally Posted by bb4_96

^can i stand on the border with a gun?

I don't know what you are getting at, but if you were to stand anywhere with a gun, I'd expect to get shot at. Just saying.

Originally Posted by Devius

Having lived in california for 18 years. Immigrations something that ive gotten "used" to. And honestly. the main thing that bothers me is the fact that they migrate over. then we as native born americans, have to learn THEIR language. which is total BS to me. its not like we go over there and expect them to speak good english. Its sort of like a slap in the face. Our country is pretty much making it comfortable for illegals to immigrate over here. we may as well roll out the damn red carpet.

Try living in Moncton, New Brunswick Canada. Its 30% french, and somehow its mandatory now that to get a basic job, you need to speek both languages. Canada is way more f'd up then your country.

But really, I can relate to you. You dont 'have to learn the language' but if you wanted a job in San Diego, I'm pretty sure it helps to know it. Same goes for many places, spite English being the most learned language, other people are ignorant to push theirs.

I'm learning Japanese for when I make my 3 month vacation to Japan. Just like how many Japanese learn English to come to Canada.

Originally Posted by kingkilburn

1. You seem to be basing your ASSumption on a bs stereotype of Americans.

2. The government has all the authority on boarder security, I have none. What do you propose I do as a lone citizen to stop illegal immigration?

1) Thats not a question, so I cannot answer

2) How about you set the example and not hire Illegal Immigrants. That's what help set this in motion in the first place. People heard of a better life in America getting paid under the table.

See, I'm not putting the blame on anyone, but Capitalism is the root of the problem in the first place. 'hey, its cheaper to hire a Mexican and pay him under the table' worked just fine back when nobody was willing to do the labor jobs.

Now that the economy has turned around, middle class citizens need any job possible, that's what brought to light this problem that was brewing years ago. (and Unions made it impossible for the business man to turn a profit: see GM, Chrysler, Ford for example)

Same thing is even going on in Dubai. Most the workers are from other countries like Pakistan, where people are desperate for work.

Its really simple. No money = no food = these people will leave on their own. Keep your 'guns' for protecting whats yours, and the law should favor shooting someone trying to steal from your house

Its not going to be easy, but its the 'reset' that needs to happen.

Btw, if anyone is looking for a safe investment, food commodities are the best. As population increases, food reserves go up. Supply and Demand.

[Walperstyle]

what double post? nothing to see here

[ronmcdon]

Originally Posted by theicecreamdan

No we don't .

agreed it's not mandatory, but it can be impractical depending on where you live & what interactions you have with the ppl around you.
living in Los Angeles & speaking for myself, honestly knowing a bit of Spanish and even Chinese, seems often insufficient.

[kingkilburn]

Originally Posted by Walperstyle

1) Thats not a question, so I cannot answer

No it's not a question but you surely have an opinion on the statement.

Originally Posted by Walperstyle

2) How about you set the example and not hire Illegal Immigrants. That's what help set this in motion in the first place. People heard of a better life in America getting paid under the table.

See, I'm not putting the blame on anyone, but Capitalism is the root of the problem in the first place. 'hey, its cheaper to hire a Mexican and pay him under the table' worked just fine back when nobody was willing to do the labor jobs.

Now that the economy has turned around, middle class citizens need any job possible, that's what brought to light this problem that was brewing years ago. (and Unions made it impossible for the business man to turn a profit: see GM, Chrysler, Ford for example)

Same thing is even going on in Dubai. Most the workers are from other countries like Pakistan, where people are desperate for work.

Its really simple. No money = no food = these people will leave on their own. Keep your 'guns' for protecting whats yours, and the law should favor shooting someone trying to steal from your house

Its not going to be easy, but its the 'reset' that needs to happen.

Btw, if anyone is looking for a safe investment, food commodities are the best. As population increases, food reserves go up. Supply and Demand.

Blaming businessmen for passively hiring illegals is skirting the problem. You don't see hotels smuggling in loads of illegals just for cheaper maids.

If both governments did their jobs in stopping people from crossing the boarder illegal labor would be a non-issue and the Mexican drug trade would all but dry up.

[Walperstyle]

Originally Posted by kingkilburn

Blaming businessmen for passively hiring illegals is skirting the problem. You don't see hotels smuggling in loads of illegals just for cheaper maids.

If both governments did their jobs in stopping people from crossing the boarder illegal labor would be a non-issue and the Mexican drug trade would all but dry up.

No, the hotels are not bringing people across, but they are gladly saying 'we need workers, greencard... what greencard, here is some money'.

My point was to stop expecting the government to solve the problem, and instead get the business owners to stop paying Illegals to work under them.

The problem will correct itself when there is no money to be made.

[raz0rbladez909]

Originally Posted by theicecreamdan

No we don't .

Correct me if I'm wrong but I remember that having to take at least 2 years of foreign language was part of the curriculum in high school?

[ronmcdon]

You don't have to learn the language of immigrants per say,
you just have to take a foreign language course.

I took french in high school,
and honestly I don't see a whole lot of french immigrants in CA.

[Touge Noob S13]

Originally Posted by Walperstyle

No, the hotels are not bringing people across, but they are gladly saying 'we need workers, greencard... what greencard, here is some money'.

My point was to stop expecting the government to solve the problem, and instead get the business owners to stop paying Illegals to work under them.

The problem will correct itself when there is no money to be made.

Technically some of the maids don't work for the hotel. Most of the maids are from "temp agencies" that pay under the table and find them work.