Ridiculous “Order Cancellation” Fees, What you can do…

[sidewaysil80]

Sadly I have been reading alot of business reviews were zilvia members are buying items that they are lead to believe are in stock and then months are going by without anything to show for it nor honest answers from the establishment. Finally, when attempting to cancel they are being told that they must pay absurd "cancellation" fee's if they wish to do so. In most instances the member can't afford to re-order the item elsewhere AND pay the cancellation fee and thus is forced to wait upwards of three, four, sometimes 6 months for an item they were originally told was instock or "shipping next week".

My bank for instance considers it a fraudulent charge if I order something and haven't received it or a tracking number within 30 days. I've had to deal with this on two separate instances with supposed "supporters" of this site. both instances my bank had me fill out a form, contacted the advertiser, and got me a full refund. One outcome after being contacted by my bank the advertiser issued the full refund. The second instance (different advertiser obviously) after being contacted they still refused to issue a refund and my bank immediatley credited my account and took legal action. (I tried to follow up since I'm nosey but they understandably would not disclose the details)

Bottom line is know your banks policies and use them if need be, know what advertiser your buying from (READ THE DAMN REVIEWS), and always ALWAYS try to work out a deal or compromise with advertisers before resorting to financial institution involvement.

If you consider this a stupid thread so be it, but a lot of members here are young and not wise to the way of the world.

Diclaimer:
I'm farrrrrrr from a legal expert and my opinions and suggestions in this post should not be taken as anything other then that...oppinons and suggestions. Furthermore, I'm in no way condoning the abuse or misuse of your banks policies to avoid a cancellation fee. In MOST instances the cancellations fee's are warranted and they are in place to protect the business from people who change and/or cancel their order post shipping and/or after the merchandise is ordered or shipped from the distributor and/or factory. Some advertisers on here abuse that and I am merely trying to help those who have or may fall victum to that.

[Otto347]

shitty..............

[Farzam]

Shit bugs me to no end. I understand in certain instances, such as ordering a high end, low-production product or something along those lines, but generally it leaves me with a bad taste in my mouth.

What especially bothers me is when they don't tell me whether they have it in stock or their vendor is distributing it. Whenever they don't personally have it, it seems to take an additional week to get it. What REALLY pisses me off is when I have to wait for them to get it then wait for them to send it...all this anger could be avoided if they didn't just bullshit me to get my CC#. I wouldn't be mad if I was given true info so I could plan accordingly, but waiting weeks for some simple ass lug nuts is pathetic.

Talking about my lug nut fiasco, I ordered from a shop (vendor on here I think), and they gave me pretty decent service. Dealt with my noob questions, pretending to care, helped me go through options, and gave me a few bucks off. Then he asked me what color blah I want and what version blah, so I told him. Over the next 2 days he told me basically half the options he initially gave me were unavailable...what I thought is that I had been pm'n back and forth and called in multiple times, in the course of those days when asking about stuff, he couldn't check his inventory? -.- not a big deal, but at the same time i'm not calling the shop to make friends, but to get exactly what I want, otherwise i'd buy it used.

I own a business, I don't talk about things for sale unless they are immediately available. otherwise I mention before, during, and after that I cannot give it to them then and there, and give them an accurate ETA. If they want to go elsewhere, sucks to be me, and if they stick with me, it's cause I gave them full disclosure and courtesy.

[gotta240]

Just curious, why didn't the OP post the names of these shitty shops? People keep getting raped cause buyers are too scared to just call the shop name out. Thats bullshit.
On the other side, good post, I'm sure many werent aware of such situations.

[sidewaysil80]

Originally Posted by gotta240

Just curious, why didn't the OP post the names of these shitty shops? People keep getting raped cause buyers are too scared to just call the shop name out.

i didn't call them out because whether i like it or not they are still vendors on this site. i gave my horrible reviews in their perspective review threads. i even went so far as to speaking with a mod regarding what would be necessary to have them banned from vendor status because of NUMEROUS complaints and out right fraud (i think i got blown off though, which is another story). i didn't want this turning into a review thread or a free for all for people to vent about shitty service.

[gunmetalr32]

that's some bull shit!

[MadScientist]

As a past Vendor and Importer, I can say the dealers are listing goods that they like to sell. Specific brands and most Manufacturers like to see you list ALL items to show support. On terms of Importing (rare or non US brands), Yes a 50%-100% non-refundable deposit is for providing a service is completly understandable. Noone wants to loose money including importers, on a rare part that will never sell... Trust me... I purchased plenty and ended up sitting on product just to eventually give away to friends!!

I never screwed over anyone, and was extreamly truthfull with ever customer... and yeah, if it took a year to get, customers knew!! Good luck finding another shop to admit to that!!

oh... and its the Manufacturers who charge a Re-Stocking Fee, and the Dealer whould have to pay that or sit on overhead... its a trickle down effect!

-Drew

[revat619]

Originally Posted by MadScientist

As a past Vendor and Importer, I can say the dealers are listing goods that they like to sell. Specific brands and most Manufacturers like to see you list ALL items to show support. On terms of Importing (rare or non US brands), Yes a 50%-100% non-refundable deposit is for providing a service is completly understandable. Noone wants to loose money including importers, on a rare part that will never sell... Trust me... I purchased plenty and ended up sitting on product just to eventually give away to friends!!

I never screwed over anyone, and was extreamly truthfull with ever customer... and yeah, if it took a year to get, customers knew!! Good luck finding another shop to admit to that!!

oh... and its the Manufacturers who charge a Re-Stocking Fee, and the Dealer whould have to pay that or sit on overhead... its a trickle down effect!

-Drew

QFT

I used to work in the vending/importing parts business as well and i couldn't agree with you more. Like you, i was always super honest with customers on how long things would take. Sometimes customers would bitch when i'd give them an ETA on a part they'd ask about. The way i always saw it though was i'd rather be truthful and tell you this shit really could take a while and perhaps get it earlier rather than lie and say "oh yeah we'll get it next week" and have it take 6 months.

[Corbic]

A few observations -

If the part is not instock - the vendor SHOULD NOT CHARGE THE CUSTOMER until they can ship it. This is standard SOP. Anyone that charges your bank or CC then says "oh, its not instock we have them on order" is not acting responsibly or in the consumers best interest.

There should never be a cancelation fee if the part is not instock. If they are doing that file a cancelation with the CC company and get your money back.

NOW - if this is a special order, then terms of prepayment and cancelation should be either discussed prior to the vendor ordering/making the part or be found somewhere in their FAQ, not just pulled out their ass when you threaten to cancel after being dicked around for 6 months.

[sidewaysil80]

Originally Posted by Corbic

A few observations -

If the part is not instock - the vendor SHOULD NOT CHARGE THE CUSTOMER until they can ship it. This is standard SOP. Anyone that charges your bank or CC then says "oh, its not instock we have them on order" is not acting responsibly or in the consumers best interest.

There should never be a cancelation fee if the part is not instock. If they are doing that file a cancelation with the CC company and get your money back.

NOW - if this is a special order, then terms of prepayment and cancelation should be either discussed prior to the vendor ordering/making the part or be found somewhere in their FAQ, not just pulled out their ass when you threaten to cancel after being dicked around for 6 months.

awesome post, as a buyer these should be some questions asked maybe via email for documentation. thanks for the input!

[MadScientist]

That would be the Terms and Conditions page... usually pops up when placing an order... you know that pesky thing everyone agrees to without reading first!

Once again its money changing hands and if I am ordering or having it Drop-Shipped from the Manufacturer... your getting charged first... even the manufacturers charge first if something is on back order to secure your place on their order! Most customers do understand this concept!

I only know of one place that I have delt with that shipped me goods before taking payment... and only because I knew the owner my entire life!!

Don't get me wrong I have alot of complaints about the Retail Auto Parts World.. Manufacureres tell you what they expect, then customers think they own you, and you honestly can't please everyone (you can try).

As a customer you need to shop around on Vendors, find one you like and make a connection... repeat customers always get treated beter!!
oh and looking for the cheepest place is usually where customers go wrong!

-Drew

[erkthejerk73]

that sucks man!

[sidewaysil80]

Originally Posted by MadScientist

That would be the Terms and Conditions page... usually pops up when placing an order... you know that pesky thing everyone agrees to without reading first!

def not all the time. i always call and place my order over the phone, or go through pm's and then call and place the order. so that kind of bypasses that. also, some of the bigger reputable shops that i order through don't have one when i order directly through their site. but i see your point. my thing is even if that is the case and you agree to it, you are agreeing to it under the impression your item is in stock or shipping that week. then when they come back and say "oh sorry not shipping for two months". this thread isn't bitching about cancellation fees, it's for when shit ass vendors or anyone for that matter pull something as described above you now have other options.

[MadScientist]

I do agree with you, however when you call to place the order are they telling you its in stock? or is that an assumption?

You should never assume something is in stock. But if they tell you its in stock... especially through a PM or any writen form, you can Cancel through your Card holder with that document as proof!

I personally hated when someone would call or place an order on, say, Wed. for something like Yashio Factory Coilovers, and expect to have them for a "Car Show" that weekend! Never ask if its a stock item (obviously not).

Sometime, ot often, the Manu would confirm that the item was in-stock, So I placed the order and wait, then the customer calls me a few weeks later and tells me the item has not arrived, so call the Manu back and get "it appears we did have stock but it was only one, and other orders came in first"

Just saying... take it easy on dealers, but don't bend over and relax!

-Drew

[enkei2k]

The reason for a cancellation fee is because vendors that use the CC service get charged a small percentage (usually about 3% or so) every time a transaction takes place, whether its a sale or a refund.

Ex 1 as a sale: You pay $100 for an item on a website, vendor charges you $100, but then CC processing service charges then $3, so technically the vendor only "makes" $97.

Ex 2 as a refund: You pay $100 for an item on a website, vendor charges you $100, but then CC processing service charges then $3, so technically the vendor only "makes" $97. And then you ask to cancel your order, the CC processing service takes another $3. So although you get your full $100 back, the vendor technically lost $6 in the transaction.

To offset this, they charge these cancellation fees, restocking fees, whatever they want to call it.

[TheWolf]

Smart vendors will avoid the charge/ refund fees by only charging when the item ships. If you can't stock it, don't sell it. If the item is not profitable enough to keep in stock especially if it's overseas, then it's not worth selling. The idea of listing thousands of items "you can order" for a customer on your website, will only result in unhappy customers. Banks and merchant account companies will not tolerate any excuse about how you took a customerss money and dont have a tracking number for their item with in 7days. I understand if a part is special order but if I goto the cat dealer and order a part from Europe for equipment then I pay for it when it gets in, not when it ships.

[bb4_96]

^ I'd be ok with that if the customer signed a contract obligating them to buy the parts when they came in.

[GhostlyCoupe]

Not sure about anyone else, but my merchant account provider would have my butt and shut me down in a heartbeat if they found out I was billing customers for merchandise that hadn't yet shipped.

I don't care if it's coming from the middle of Siberia in Russia. If you actually had the part on the way for the customer, there would be a paper trail of tracking numbers, customs forms, and bill of lading you could give the customers copies of along the way to show the product is in transit. If you can't do it, you don't deserve the business.

This is directed at businesses that give a delivery date that they KNOW they cannot fulfill. Special order items with pre-discussed delays are obviously different.

There's no excuse, it's plain and simple using that customers money to do other things then proceeding to lie to the customer about why you haven't got off your butt to fill their order. Most of these businesses are using the money you pay up front to pay operating costs and then buying the product to fulfill your order when they get money back in. It's deceptive business practice plain and simple.

I've got some grumbles about a certain vendor being allowed to keep doing this to customers as well. Don't think anything will be done about it since they finally gave me my money back after screwing around for almost a month.

[jenifer123]

You should talk to company about it, it if they don’t do anything for it, you can claim for it, well I prefer merchant account where I have full security of my money.


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credit card processing merchant services

[harrypotter]

Man your battle stations, we are under attack still!

Above two are spam, and reported.

[kingkilburn]

Originally Posted by jenifer123

You should talk to company about it, it if they don’t do anything for it, you can claim for it, well I prefer merchant account where I have full security of my money.


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credit card processing merchant services

What the crap? I'll give the spammer credit for the fake sig. lol