JWT vs Enthalpy ECU comparison dyno results!! *Another* 400 whp CodyAce Built Car

[S13 curtis]

Originally Posted by 4x4le

The boost controller comment I made was directed at s13curtis as a suggestions to use a boost controller like your avc-r instead of just setting the boost at 28psi because up top that would surely not be effecient.

.

Lol at hemi charger bashing.

But yea im running an AEM EMS with eletronic boost control solenoid so controlling boost shouldnt be a problem

[mattsil80wis]

Originally Posted by jspaeth

That is the kind of statement that is creating arguments in this thread

Cody was just trying to reiterate that ROM tunes are a great option.

But sayung that it is BETTER than a standalone is just downright idioitic, and again, misleading.

Rip the ROM ECU out of your car and put an AEM or PFC in and let an equally qualified person tune it (i.e. JW or RSE) and they can do just as well.

Saying it is "better" is just assinine.

i didnt mean better for tuning i meant it for best bang for your buck

to me i feel like for the power to price ratio a ROM tune wins

[codyace]

Originally Posted by 4x4le

a $63 gauge from autometer most likely is not a wideband and cannot handle air fuel ratio.....

You mean narowband isn't good enough? Aw shucks man! hahaha. I bet HemiCharger swears by his

Originally Posted by 4x4le

codace, is your 4.6 gear out of a r51 front? And do you know what the wheel speeds are from gear to gear? I understand if you dont know what it tops out at in 4th or 5th but but mostly im consirned with top speed in 2nd through 4th (also what tire size are you running)?
I would love a lower gear but Im afraid it could cause more shifting than I would want in a drift car.

I actually had no clue what an R51 was, so now I know

Yes, mine is out of a Nissan Xterra. It's the front diff. They come with 4.3/4.6/4.9. I know the 4.6 and 4.9 work, but am sure if the 4.3 does.

4th gear tops out at 128/130 on two different GPS things...unsure why different, but it's a glitch maybe?

I'm not sure what 2nd or 3rd top out out to be quit honest...I would use a gear calculator for this. I run a 255/35/18 in the back, so that will lower the numerical 'effective' rear ratio for sure.

In regard to drifting, i really can't even provide any insight, other than I know that some S/Florida guys use them and love it...but I've never personally drifted, so I can't help. Sorry !

[codyace]

Originally Posted by HemiCharger

Tuning is not some secret freaking thing that only a few people are good at. I mean a lot of people own cars and tune then up especially for Nissan and I am happy codyace has such a great tuner. It does not matter to me other than you all are trying to say go ROM tune over standalone cause they make more power when that clearly would not be the case. It is also great that your ROM tune allows you to monitor those channels but you do not have the time to stop your car or look at your laptop while you are pushing out 6000+ rpm shifts.

Well, in your case the ROM tune does make more power. Sure tuning is easy...did you tune your own car? Exactly my point. If tuning was easy, everyone would have stand alones and doing it themselves. Trust me, more people egg bottom ends with crappy custom tunes than safe rom tunes, that's for damn sure.

PS: You're only lying to yourself if you're monitering the gauges 100% of the time at that rpm. I dunno about you, but I keep an eye on where my car is going, not gauges at that speed/rpm. I log, review, and make needed adustments. That's what safe/normal guys do. Trust me, people aren't out street tuning their 700 hp Supra's looking at the gauges...they fatten em up, log, and get some power out after they are safe....

Originally Posted by HemiCharger

I know other people that read this and will go whoa I will go out and make 400whp with a JWT tune not specifically made for my car then blow their shit up and be like what went wrong? Again, My PFC has been tuned at what it runs now for over a year and a half. There was no guessing with it and not much to chance.

You are pretty much talking out of your ass here. Seriously, will you get off your own bandwagon. I promise you, that there are easily 5:1 as many rom tune as custom tune guys out there. We drive street cars, nto race cars. Why you think ROM tunes blow up cars is beyond me. Quit being such a ignorant closed minded jackoff, it's quite annoying. Have you not realized that everyone in this thread thinks you're a moron?? Want me to send you the PM's? I've said 100 times, Standlones are great- but for a 350 hp car, they are not any safer, better, or more reliable than a ROM tune. No way, no how. I'm not sure why you need to justify spending what you did to make 350 hp, but the rest of us are content with an ECU. You don't see me talking smack in the PFC thread do you? No.

Originally Posted by HemiCharger

Additionally, if you are given the choice of a ROM verses a Standalone then look over the options really well. The RISK is less with a Standalone and they can control all things. Oh yeah I also have working A/C in my car as well as cruise control, intermittent wipers --everything works like it was from the factory that way..... just saying......

Um, so do I. So do all rom tunes. Once again, your lack of knowledge is showing, as all of those items work when the car is WIRED properly, not through a tune. Then again, I guess your tuner forgot that. The basic ECU functions all remain, it's just the daughterboard that is different.

But while you want to compare, I have launch control, a water injection map (both selectable) and still have 2 other 'maps' I can run (race gas maybe? fuel milage tune? nitrous??) Can your PFC do that?? My Shitty JWT ECU can. Ya know, the one that makes more power than yours. I wish I coulda spend all that cash to make less average/peak/usable power than you. Hi Five? Maybe the car I made this thread shoulda done the same thing. Maybe the countless other guys out there doing the same thing right? Hell my buddy is making 360 whp with a 28RS in a Sentra, at 17 psi...maybe he should follow your trend too?? JWT really screwed his car up. Turbo since 2001, tracked 5 times every summer, if not more. No problems ever. Stock DE. I guess your way is best, we should all follow it...JWT or Enthalpy are just idiots that can't tune cars, but your tuner is the best. I guess the 50-100 I know personally using their ECU for years now are all going to blow up tomorrow right?

Where is your dyno again? Care to post it? I'm sure it's the worlds best SR20 graph of all time according to you. Quit being a blockhead, and please make your own thread about how awesome your car is. Seriously, nobody cares about another 350 whp 240, as their are 500 of them out there. You have a custom tune, congratulations. Your tuner and you are best friensd. Awesome. Nobody really cares. You've not added a single piece of good information here, other than what you've regurgitated from your tuner, or what you read in Nissan Sport.

(God, I hate acting 13 but I had to get that off my chest). PLEASE HEMI CHARGER, STOP POSTING. I'll be sending a PM to the moderators tomorrow to clean this up.

[4x4le]

i almost fell for it. i was about to go pfc but codayce talked me out of it lolol.

hopefully this weather lets up and im going to fuel up the car and hit the dyno.



Sent from my Eris using Tapatalk

[HemiCharger]

Originally Posted by 4x4le

i almost fell for it. i was about to go pfc but codayce talked me out of it lolol.

hopefully this weather lets up and im going to fuel up the car and hit the dyno.



Sent from my Eris using Tapatalk

all I was saying is think about it that it is all-- you car (codyace) sounded so good on the dyno as well. was that smoke or spark knock or what coming out your tail pipe?


the bottom line is codyace and some of the other ROM tuners are on their second or third engine. I am on my first and am happy. Of course I do not have the time to tear down and rebuild an engine every 6 - 8 months though. I have a feeling if you had a Power FC you would be talking about how great they were and how no body should use anything else. Another guy in this thread shares my opinion on standalone systems. I am not bragging on my car and never said it was so great but you codyace- act like a 13 year old fast and furious RICER who had the remote taking away from them while playing Need for Speed.

[SoSideways]

Seriously.

Hemicharger, you're digging deeper and deeper. You should really stop.

Did you even read why Cody blew up his engine? It's not because of his tune.

[4x4le]

hahahah. im pretty sure i have some spark knock coming out of my tailpipe now that you mention it



Sent from my Eris using Tapatalk

[2fast4y0u]

Originally Posted by HemiCharger

the bottom line is codyace and some of the other ROM tuners are on their second or third engine. I am on my first and am happy. Of course I do not have the time to tear down and rebuild an engine every 6 - 8 months though. I have a feeling if you had a Power FC you would be talking about how great they were and how no body should use anything else. Another guy in this thread shares my opinion on standalone systems. I am not bragging on my car and never said it was so great but you codyace- act like a 13 year old fast and furious RICER who had the remote taking away from them while playing Need for Speed.

im actually on my first sr that i have had in my car for 7 years now...all i have done is bolt on extras...turbo, IM, etc..
so its not ROM tunes that blow up your car over stand alones...mines never blown up.

maybe i should put in my AEM ems so my sr NEVER blows up...EVER

[inopsey]

Originally Posted by codyace

But while you want to compare, I have launch control, a water injection map (both selectable) and still have 2 other 'maps' I can run (race gas maybe? fuel milage tune? nitrous??) Can your PFC do that?? My Shitty JWT ECU can.

i did not know that a jwt ecu had launch control and different selectable maps available, as well as dataloging capabilities. are there accessory electronics to allow these functions/how do you datalog a jwt ecu?

[2fast4y0u]

my enthalpy tune has a launch controller on it...dont know if i can do other maps but il let you know shortly.

[SoSideways]

You can ask them to put them on there for you.

Not sure if there is an extra charge for it or not, but that stuff is all do-able on the eprom.

[mattsil80wis]

Originally Posted by HemiCharger

all I was saying is think about it that it is all-- you car (codyace) sounded so good on the dyno as well. was that smoke or spark knock or what coming out your tail pipe?

with JWT tunes its a little bit richer causing it to have smoke coming out of the exhaust. There was no knock or detanation coming from his exhaust..hence why there was someone there listening to it (ie that guy is the one that owns the turbo sentra with the 28rs)

Originally Posted by HemiCharger

the bottom line is codyace and some of the other ROM tuners are on their second or third engine. I am on my first and am happy. Of course I do not have the time to tear down and rebuild an engine every 6 - 8 months though. I have a feeling if you had a Power FC you would be talking about how great they were and how no body should use anything else. Another guy in this thread shares my opinion on standalone systems. I am not bragging on my car and never said it was so great but you codyace- act like a 13 year old fast and furious RICER who had the remote taking away from them while playing Need for Speed.

cody had to rebuild his motor not because of a tune issue but because an o-ring failed...the rebuilt motor has been running for 3 yrs now iirc..cody built my motor and its been almost a year of it running at this power level and no problems....so there goes your rebuild every 6-8 month theory.

cody is simply trying to say, which this seems to be the hardest for you to understand, (direct quote from before in the thread)

Originally Posted by codyace

I've said 100 times, Standlones are great- but for a 350 hp car, they are not any safer, better, or more reliable than a ROM tune. No way, no how. I'm not sure why you need to justify spending what you did to make 350 hp, but the rest of us are content with an ECU.

[mattsil80wis]

Originally Posted by SoSideways

You can ask them to put them on there for you.

Not sure if there is an extra charge for it or not, but that stuff is all do-able on the eprom.

they will put it on for an extra charge because it requires another board to control it all

[SoSideways]

Good to know.

Thanks!

[codyace]

Originally Posted by HemiCharger

all I was saying is think about it that it is all-- you car (codyace) sounded so good on the dyno as well. was that smoke or spark knock or what coming out your tail pipe?

Just raw fuel for the most part. They are a little on the fat side, but that's fine. Also, camera sensors pick up vapor, which would appear as 'smoke' on video.

Originally Posted by HemiCharger

the bottom line is codyace and some of the other ROM tuners are on their second or third engine. I am on my first and am happy. Of course I do not have the time to tear down and rebuild an engine every 6 - 8 months though.

It failed because one of those larger inlet manifold gromets pushed up around the injector (the pencil style don't hold those down). It simply melted a hole in that piston, and that one only. Other 3 had no detonation, and the rod bearings didn't have any heat/detonation beating marks. 20 psi, top of third, and it felt like a intercooler coupler ripped. Drove it home and everything. That poor motor lasted nearly 10,000 miles and a full summer of rocking the snot out of it at the track. I didn't owe it a dime, especially with how poorly I treat the engines. I build them for fun cars, not to daily drive...but it just so happens that they last too.

And yes, 3 years/20k track and street car. That's good enough for me.

Originally Posted by HemiCharger

I have a feeling if you had a Power FC you would be talking about how great they were and how no body should use anything else. Another guy in this thread shares my opinion on standalone systems. I am not bragging on my car and never said it was so great but you codyace- act like a 13 year old fast and furious RICER who had the remote taking away from them while playing Need for Speed.

Are you done trying yet? I wouldn't brag at all about a piggy back controller that does everything that a ROM can do. Heck CalumSult does everything as well too. So does NisTune! Both considerably cheaper than a PFC.

Plus, I would be bragging about my awesome tuner, not so much me. Either way, I'm sorry you take it as bragging, as my intention (which I've said 100x now, it's apparent you can't read) was to show that our top 2 ECU manufactuers make awesome setups for street cars. I never said PFC was junk, nor did I say any standalone was. Never. Again, you don't even read what people write, so I can accept that you honestly missed those posts. Bottom line is, for 98% of 400 hp SR20 owners, a Standalone is simply overkill for their setups. 500 bucks gets you a safe 400 hp? That's good enough for me.

I'm not trying to convince people to buy PFC over ROM or ROM over PFC - Again just showing the capability of our best Nissan Rom tuners in their current state.

Trust me, the last thing I'm concerned about is impressing you. Taking the remote away lol.



See you on track sometime? I'll give you a ride along too. I don't hold grudges. I'm at The Glen, Pocono, NJMP, Monticello all summer. Maybe I'll even go out to BeaverRun if you want to meet half way.

Originally Posted by 2fast4y0u

my enthalpy tune has a launch controller on it...dont know if i can do other maps but il let you know shortly.

NICE! I didn't know he offered them so that's awesome!!

Originally Posted by SoSideways

You can ask them to put them on there for you.

Not sure if there is an extra charge for it or not, but that stuff is all do-able on the eprom.

There probably is an extra charge (as matt said) they involve a seperate board as well.

[lflkajfj12123]

The only cool thing about the POWER FC is the little gameboy it comes with that you can like velcro to your dash or put it in a cup holder to look pretty.

[HemiCharger]

I got my PFC from the New Zea-land ebay site and it was less than 800 bucks delivered. iirc

I was not bragging either since I do not have much to brag about. I am on cosmetic stuff now. Have my Conti DWS tires with my r32 skyline wheels and just now need a front lip... anyone have a cool front lip for an s14 that they want to get rid of????

pm me

[jspaeth]

I like the PFC. I just recently bought datalogit, and it provides a nice environment for me to conveniently plug in my computer to the car and tinker with things and learn how everything works.

I would say if you REALLY are the kind of person (like I am) that wants to learn the whole EFI thing on your own and tinker with stuff in a safe and fun way, the PFC is really really nice.

To each his own.

Again, PFC costs more, but both units can (ultimately) do the same things, no problem.

PFC you can have an infinite number of tunes, saved to your computer, and with a click of a button, you reflash the whole tune to whichever version you want.


The past couple of nice weekends, I have been doing AFR tuning in all of the vaccuum--->0 boost cells, 1200-5000 RPM, with the intent of getting the AFRs smooth and nice and lean for cruising.

I datalog, get the results, make changes in a spreadsheet, copy and paste them into datalogit, save as a new file, and upload.

Then go out, drive, make changes, repeat.

It's really fun and educational!

[mattsil80wis]

Originally Posted by jspaeth

I like the PFC. I just recently bought datalogit, and it provides a nice environment for me to conveniently plug in my computer to the car and tinker with things and learn how everything works.

I would say if you REALLY are the kind of person (like I am) that wants to learn the whole EFI thing on your own and tinker with stuff in a safe and fun way, the PFC is really really nice.

To each his own.

Again, PFC costs more, but both units can (ultimately) do the same things, no problem.

PFC you can have an infinite number of tunes, saved to your computer, and with a click of a button, you reflash the whole tune to whichever version you want.


The past couple of nice weekends, I have been doing AFR tuning in all of the vaccuum--->0 boost cells, 1200-5000 RPM, with the intent of getting the AFRs smooth and nice and lean for cruising.

I datalog, get the results, make changes in a spreadsheet, copy and paste them into datalogit, save as a new file, and upload.

Then go out, drive, make changes, repeat.

It's really fun and educational!

that is pretty sweet actually

but i know cody feels this way too, if i had the ability to change the tune, i would screw something up or push the limits of the tune to get more power out of it

[jspaeth]

Originally Posted by mattsil80wis

that is pretty sweet actually

but i know cody feels this way too, if i had the ability to change the tune, i would screw something up or push the limits of the tune to get more power out of it

If you read up and do research, you are fine.

Gotta have proper stuff (knock sensor that oyu know works, wideband, laptop, etc.)

Make small changes, check, etc.

In terms of "light load" portion of the map, there isn't a whole lot you can mess am.

I am on a MAP sensor, so top part of the map (negative pressures) are not going to have a flow much different than OEM, so I am using OEM-ish timing....

I log AFR, divide it by target AFR, then scale the injector open time by that percent.

Iterate, more data, check.


Compared to when my car was "tuned" professionally, my AFRs are way 1) Smoother and B) leaner (in a good way, for economy) than they were when it came off being tuned.


Before, the AFRs were all over the place from cell to cell, now they are pretty damn smooth

[HemiCharger]

Originally Posted by jspaeth

If you read up and do research, you are fine.

Gotta have proper stuff (knock sensor that oyu know works, wideband, laptop, etc.)

Make small changes, check, etc.

In terms of "light load" portion of the map, there isn't a whole lot you can mess am.

I am on a MAP sensor, so top part of the map (negative pressures) are not going to have a flow much different than OEM, so I am using OEM-ish timing....

I log AFR, divide it by target AFR, then scale the injector open time by that percent.

Iterate, more data, check.


Compared to when my car was "tuned" professionally, my AFRs are way 1) Smoother and B) leaner (in a good way, for economy) than they were when it came off being tuned.


Before, the AFRs were all over the place from cell to cell, now they are pretty damn smooth

do you have comparable mods to what I run? I might be interested in learning your method of tuning and how you smoothed it out? Tuning is the key to everything. With the right tune you can get engine longevity and gas mileage. You have them saved as .bin files or what? and do you have a website that talks about this? thanks

[mattsil80wis]

Originally Posted by jspaeth

If you read up and do research, you are fine.

Gotta have proper stuff (knock sensor that oyu know works, wideband, laptop, etc.)

Make small changes, check, etc.

In terms of "light load" portion of the map, there isn't a whole lot you can mess am.

I am on a MAP sensor, so top part of the map (negative pressures) are not going to have a flow much different than OEM, so I am using OEM-ish timing....

I log AFR, divide it by target AFR, then scale the injector open time by that percent.

Iterate, more data, check.


Compared to when my car was "tuned" professionally, my AFRs are way 1) Smoother and B) leaner (in a good way, for economy) than they were when it came off being tuned.


Before, the AFRs were all over the place from cell to cell, now they are pretty damn smooth

its comments like this that i actually like coming on to this forum for...where ppl say intelligent information that help ppl with what they need

maybe when i become a baller ill buy a standalone and let you tune it

ps where in s jerz you from? im from hackensack (also have a house by seaside heights) we gotta meet up sometime

[jspaeth]

Originally Posted by HemiCharger

do you have comparable mods to what I run? I might be interested in learning your method of tuning and how you smoothed it out? Tuning is the key to everything. With the right tune you can get engine longevity and gas mileage. You have them saved as .bin files or what? and do you have a website that talks about this? thanks

Not sure what tour mods are....by no means am I an "expert"

Heck, i literally have NEVER tuned my car on a dyno.

Taking baby steps though. I have read about (probably total of 50+ hours) the PFC on all kinds of forums (Skyline, Celica, RX7, etc) to learn how EVERY possible thing on it functions.

Now that I know HOW it works, I am starting to put it into action. Simplest thing you can do without breaking shit is to make small fuel adjustments.

Without a dyno to hold steady state, you can't really do AFR tuning of load cells, but you can do a decent job of hitting the vacuum part of the map if you are very careful with the throttle, and SLOWLY sweep through all of the different cells.

Anyway, we can discuss this through PM or another thread.

Originally Posted by mattsil80wis

its comments like this that i actually like coming on to this forum for...where ppl say intelligent information that help ppl with what they need

maybe when i become a baller ill buy a standalone and let you tune it

ps where in s jerz you from? im from hackensack (also have a house by seaside heights) we gotta meet up sometime

I have been trying to meet up with Cody for a meet or just to put a face to the name and have a beer or something, but he is pretty busy.

Yeah, I would totally be down to meet up some time. I am in the central jersey area, about 15 minutes north of trenton.

Trust me, you wouldn;'t want me to tune your car, I have NO experience.

I feel like I have a really good grasp on the theory after many (over 50) hours of reading, but am just now starting to put it into action.

I have a crazy fuel issue that has been nagging me (talked to Cody about it...), once I fix that and make sure my fuel setup is 100% flawless, I may do some dyno tuning myself for the first time!

[mattsil80wis]

took it to PM so i didnt fill the thread with nonsense

[HemiCharger]

Originally Posted by mattsil80wis

took it to PM so i didnt fill the thread with nonsense

x2 -- my tune is spot on to Shell V Power 93 anything else and it wants to spark knock under certain loads. That is what I had it tuned on and that is what she likes. No other fuel is quite as good as it but it is all around me right now. I will hit you up on pm. Yeah I definitely do not want to screw around with it too much thansk

[2fast4y0u]

yeah, Enthalpy makes it so its not on the clutch switch. he does speed to a certain MPH and then it turns off automatically.

[4x4le]

Originally Posted by HemiCharger

x2 -- my tune is spot on to Shell V Power 93 anything else and it wants to spark knock under certain loads. That is what I had it tuned on and that is what she likes. No other fuel is quite as good as it but it is all around me right now. I will hit you up on pm. Yeah I definitely do not want to screw around with it too much thansk

Please define this spark knock.... To me that is another word for detenation, but is that what your meaning by it? Or are you getting blow out? Do you see signs of detenation on your plugs? What is making you think you have detenation? Is it audible? Or are you feeling something (shouldnt be able to do unless its severe) or is your hand commander or whatever saying you have it? Either way, shell is great gas but you are tuned on the ragged edge if you have detenation with all other brands of fuel, but your power numbers do not reflect a tune on the ragged edge.


There is something else I have seen that seems to be pretty common in this thread that I as a tuner dont like to see. People tuning off of knock sensors. They are not 100% reliable. They are great for putting a little fear in you, such as if you just filled up with fuel and you see your knock % raise then that fuel might be bad. However they do miss allot of legit knock and they pick up on allot of phantom knock. There are many different tools and methods for listening to knock. My suggestion to anyone doing their own tuning (especially if you incest on doing some street tuning) would be to run an overly safe timing map and start out rich on your fuel map taking fuel out as needed. Get your afr's smooth and in check and then hit the dyno. If your tuning on pump gas I would recomend a listening device of some sort. If your on a detenation resistant fuel you still really need to just pay attention to the tq curve (as you need to on any fuel). Watching the tq curve is major. If it goes down in a spot and then back up you should lower the timing there to see if it goes back up. If it goes down you might need more timing. It can also be caused by other things too. Like on the graph I posted of my run you see the tq drop off at 6300 and come back up around 6900, I did not overlay my boost on that graph I posted but if I were to add that you would see that the boost spiked up about 1 psi at 6900 giving it an odd curve. That is acceptible because there was most likely allot of back pressure at that point and the internal gate can only do so much.

My point is dont take knock sensor reading with a grain of salt if your getting them, but dont rely on them and dont expect them to work when its most important. Please do not base your tune off of a knock sensor.

[2fast4y0u]

update: talked to my good friend at Enthalpy today. they can do 2 tunes...pump gas race gas, pump gas e85...which ever combo you want. selectable through a simple switch.

cant wait to try that out. race gas, here i come.

[HemiCharger]

Originally Posted by 4x4le

Please define this spark knock.... To me that is another word for detenation, but is that what your meaning by it? Or are you getting blow out? Do you see signs of detenation on your plugs? What is making you think you have detenation? Is it audible? Or are you feeling something (shouldnt be able to do unless its severe) or is your hand commander or whatever saying you have it? Either way, shell is great gas but you are tuned on the ragged edge if you have detenation with all other brands of fuel, but your power numbers do not reflect a tune on the ragged edge.


There is something else I have seen that seems to be pretty common in this thread that I as a tuner dont like to see. People tuning off of knock sensors. They are not 100% reliable. They are great for putting a little fear in you, such as if you just filled up with fuel and you see your knock % raise then that fuel might be bad. However they do miss allot of legit knock and they pick up on allot of phantom knock. There are many different tools and methods for listening to knock. My suggestion to anyone doing their own tuning (especially if you incest on doing some street tuning) would be to run an overly safe timing map and start out rich on your fuel map taking fuel out as needed. Get your afr's smooth and in check and then hit the dyno. If your tuning on pump gas I would recomend a listening device of some sort. If your on a detenation resistant fuel you still really need to just pay attention to the tq curve (as you need to on any fuel). Watching the tq curve is major. If it goes down in a spot and then back up you should lower the timing there to see if it goes back up. If it goes down you might need more timing. It can also be caused by other things too. Like on the graph I posted of my run you see the tq drop off at 6300 and come back up around 6900, I did not overlay my boost on that graph I posted but if I were to add that you would see that the boost spiked up about 1 psi at 6900 giving it an odd curve. That is acceptible because there was most likely allot of back pressure at that point and the internal gate can only do so much.

My point is dont take knock sensor reading with a grain of salt if your getting them, but dont rely on them and dont expect them to work when its most important. Please do not base your tune off of a knock sensor.

I know what you are talking about on the knock sensor thing. I ran an oil sandwich plate for my oil sending unit gauge and the knock sensor would pick up rattles from my oil sandwich plate. I switched to the Nisport adapter and my knock count went way down. I refer to spark knock as detonation they are the same. When you hear a supersonic ping and fire comes out your tailpipe you know to get off of it. I have only experencied it a couple of times when I went to BP 93 since you would think all 93s would be the same. I have found there are differences in fuel grades and sometimes containment get into fuel even the supreme stuff. This can lead to detonation especially on my car -- I switch it to wastegate low boost on my greddy profec and run it out then run shell 93. I really have never had any problems with the shell 93 gas other brands sometimes mix ethanol with their high grades and I think this screws around with my tune and it does not know what to do with the e85 shit.

Yes I know spark blow out cause I have had that too. It happened when I did not regap my BKr7e-11s to .028 or whatever. I regapped my plugs and all is good. I have also found that differences in temperature and load make a difference in performance. I really do not want to kill my engine so I will get off it or not run it under full load when it starts to detonate due to bad gas or whatever. The PC gives a knock count and from what I have read anything over 60 is a bad thing and the CEL flashes like crazy.....