General politics discussion. Keep it civil.

[collegekid]

I wrote a reply earlier but Zilvia was too busy at the moment.

The only thing I care to write again is my disappointment in the fact that people in general can?t handle multi faceted situations. Everything has to be heads vs tails, red team vs blue team, us vs them.

You?re either a democrat or republican, can?t be anything else.

Keep up the conversations here though. Maybe we will get somewhere.



On another note, this shit is bananas.


https://www.militarytimes.com/news/y...me-to-protect/


What a great way to treat the people who came running to protect your sorry ass.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[kingkilburn]

Basically every representative and senator was scrambling for a solution. Have to wonder who made that decision.

[Antihero983]

Not a good look for anyone, for sure.

[RalliartRsX]

Originally Posted by collegekid

I wrote a reply earlier but Zilvia was too busy at the moment.

The only thing I care to write again is my disappointment in the fact that people in general can?t handle multi faceted situations. Everything has to be heads vs tails, red team vs blue team, us vs them.

You?re either a democrat or republican, can?t be anything else.

Keep up the conversations here though. Maybe we will get somewhere.



On another note, this shit is bananas.


https://www.militarytimes.com/news/y...me-to-protect/


What a great way to treat the people who came running to protect your sorry ass.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I wish people would read past the headlines....No where in the article does it state elected officials made the call.

However after 3 sec Google search, it was VERY apparent it was NOT the doing of the elected officials but the DC Capitol Police....

Thousands of National Guardsmen were allowed back into the Capitol Thursday night, hours after U.S. Capitol Police officials ordered them to vacate the facilities, sending them outdoors or to nearby parking garages after two weeks pulling security duty after the deadly riot on Jan. 6.

https://www.politico.com/news/2021/0...capitol-461220

This is a perfect example of why we cannot have a civil discussion.....

And another example of how people need to look past just a headline....

That was an ABSOLUTE SHITTTY article by the Military Times.NO citation, no official remarks, no nothing. Just another story to throw incendiaries at the fire.

Fuck that

[RalliartRsX]

Originally Posted by kingkilburn

Basically every representative and senator was scrambling for a solution. Have to wonder who made that decision.

I recommend you take the time to do a little digging instead of running with a headline....

See my post above.

[Future240]

This is a special kind of stupid.

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/rep...-against-biden

[collegekid]

Originally Posted by RalliartRsX

I recommend you take the time to do a little digging instead of running with a headline....

See my post above.

Hey there, I'm NOT trying to say any of the following

-It's the Dems fault
-It's the Reps fault
-Bad Capitol Police Nyahhhhh
-Any blame on a specific group of people, however you label them


I don't know the specifics. All I'm trying to say is, National Guard was deployed to protect the Capitol. I don't care who called and said "National Guard, HALP!" Look at this treatment after they served their purpose. This is embarrassing and outrageous. It is deplorable that this is what you subject your protectors to.

Don't turn this into "Collegekid is a Left Libtard Democrat or White supremacist MAGA Republican". I'm just saying, "Bad situation is Bad."


Edit
I do have both articles open, no one is owning up to exactly who made the Guardsmen GTFO. I'm not going to sit here and pull quotes from both articles that basically say "It wasn't me".

Edit #2
Is twitter really the official channel for communication that our Lawmakers/Government workers are using? Is this where we should be watching our political news? I'm genuinely asking.

A lot of people are still sippin the DumbF*ck juice apparently. In all this Democrat vs Republican party nonsense, I'm not seeing any reassurance that they are working for the people. This is just like watching a bad soap opera at this point.

[RalliartRsX]

Originally Posted by collegekid

Hey there, I'm NOT trying to say any of the following

-It's the Dems fault
-It's the Reps fault
-Bad Capitol Police Nyahhhhh
-Any blame on a specific group of people, however you label them


I don't know the specifics. All I'm trying to say is, National Guard was deployed to protect the Capitol. I don't care who called and said "National Guard, HALP!" Look at this treatment after they served their purpose. This is embarrassing and outrageous. It is deplorable that this is what you subject your protectors to.

And this is where I call bullshit. As you stated in your very post

What a great way to treat the people who came running to protect your sorry ass.

That to me states you are saying it is the elected officials....As they were the ones under siege in the Capitol.....

Either way, I agree with your sentiments. It is absolute bullshit situation in and out.....

Anyways, I was talking in generalities. And my statement you quoted above was directed to king....

[RalliartRsX]

Originally Posted by collegekid

Hey there, I'm NOT trying to say any of the following

-It's the Dems fault
-It's the Reps fault
-Bad Capitol Police Nyahhhhh
-Any blame on a specific group of people, however you label them


I don't know the specifics. All I'm trying to say is, National Guard was deployed to protect the Capitol. I don't care who called and said "National Guard, HALP!" Look at this treatment after they served their purpose. This is embarrassing and outrageous. It is deplorable that this is what you subject your protectors to.

Don't turn this into "Collegekid is a Left Libtard Democrat or White supremacist MAGA Republican". I'm just saying, "Bad situation is Bad."


Edit
I do have both articles open, no one is owning up to exactly who made the Guardsmen GTFO. I'm not going to sit here and pull quotes from both articles that basically say "It wasn't me".

Edit #2
Is twitter really the official channel for communication that our Lawmakers/Government workers are using? Is this where we should be watching our political news? I'm genuinely asking.

A lot of people are still sippin the DumbF*ck juice apparently. In all this Democrat vs Republican party nonsense, I'm not seeing any reassurance that they are working for the people. This is just like watching a bad soap opera at this point.

EDIT 2 addressed; trump essentially made twitter his legislative and communication branch the last 4 years. How many high level folks has he fired over twitter before notifying the proper channels??

Not to be a dick, but this has been the norm for the last 4 years since trump took office. Not sure if you were paying attention or not

However, twitter is a tool. And just like everything else, it is HOW you use it. That is key.

There is alot of bullshit to sift through, but a little time and thought, you can wade through all of the crap.

Sorry to come off as a dick. But man, I wish people would write better fucking articles.

[KA24DESOneThree]

Originally Posted by Corbic

Authoritarian is as Authoritarian does.

What can I say? As someone who has voted for anti-war, pro-market, pro-freedom, small-government candidates in the past three elections, I am about as authoritarian as they come. I have a fenced-off section of my back yard that has shackles anchored to the ground every twelve feet; it's going to be my gulag for people who oppose the rule of my leaders.

Please show me condoning anyone or anything. You linked me supporting Homeland targeting suspected agitators and arresting them in low profile ways.

Just using your tactics against you. feelsbadman.jpg

I'm glad you'd rather get into a historical semantics debate rather then addressing the hypocrisy and actual issues.

The reality is, what happened on January 6th was par for the course in terms of the last 10 years of political based action - riot, protest or otherwise.

Yet you and your corporate overlords are shitting themselves, black listing, banning and calling for counter terrorism efforts. How long before China Joe starts drone striking people?

Me and my corporate overlords? Au contraire, mon frere, I didn't shit myself or call for the banning of accounts. I merely felt incredible disappointment that the people would damage the Capitol and interrupt a session of Congress because they were too brainwashed to accept the truth.

Joe Biden's not my president, just as his predecessors weren't. You're too busy thinking I'm a pansexual genderqueer antifa rioter to realize that I find Biden and most of his cabinet reprehensible- but far less reprehensible than the idiot snakes who occupied the office prior.

If you had a memory longer than the latest news cycle, you'd realize the "Right" has not moved to the extreme. They haven't moved in 60 years. It's the left that has moved and just calls the right extreme because they are farther away.

If a large portion of the Right believes a fair election is stolen, that is extreme. If a large portion of the Right is willing to eschew conservative values in favor of electing a New York City chameleon, that is extreme. It's really hard to be the party of family values with Trump holding the reins.

So rather then "coming together", you've impeached the president again, which means fuck all while accosting 80 million Americans as extremist terrorists.

Reddit is not everyone. I don't think you or my employees or my father are extremist terrorists. Extremists, maybe, but terrorists? No. Everyone who breached the Capitol with the intention of damaging democracy is a terrorist, and you should condemn them in the strongest manner. But I'm not hearing that from you or my employees or my father. I'm hearing excuses, not outrage.

This could have all been avoided had you accepted the proposal to hold a 10 independent investigation to review the accusations of voter fraud.

After all , you did support a now debunked 4 year Russia Collusion Investigation predicated on what was essentially election tampering by the DNC....

So should we have had an independent investigation of the Russian collusion case? After all, if we cannot trust our government, we're gonna have to outsource everything. If we're going to outsource anything, the full financials from the past decade and a security review of the third-party investigators would be required for the United States to trust them.

You keep thinking that everyone who disagrees with you is a Democrat. Not true, has not been true, but like s14 and zombie, you consider yourself a persecuted minority, beaten on by big mean Dems.

Deolio? Not a Dem. Me? Not a Dem. Kilburn? Not a Dem.

And yet, you think we are. You think, like many conservatives do, that you're nailed to the cross as the salvation of the United States while the people you support are busy palletizing their money off the backs of Americans.

Both sides are full of awful people. Both sides are full of people who have used others as stepping stones, who have used taxpayers as retribution for the transgressions of drunkards and addicts. Both sides are outmoded, undisciplined echo chambers of half-baked ideas.

[kingkilburn]

Originally Posted by RalliartRsX

I recommend you take the time to do a little digging instead of running with a headline....

See my post above.

As far as I can see there's still no specific culprit here. You don't know what I have or haven't read and can't possibly infer that from what I said. Maybe cool off.


In other news
https://www.washingtonpost.com/us-po...edit-stimulus/

This would be life changing for millions of people. Universal basic income, education, and healthcare is the only way forward I see that isn't just spinning the tires.

[deolio]

Originally Posted by kingkilburn

Universal basic income, education, and healthcare is the only way forward I see that isn't just spinning the tires.

They better hide those parts inside a bill for military spending

[Corbic]

Originally Posted by KA24DESOneThree

You keep thinking that everyone who disagrees with you is a Democrat. Not true, has not been true, but like s14 and zombie, you consider yourself a persecuted minority, beaten on by big mean Dems.

Deolio? Not a Dem. Me? Not a Dem. Kilburn? Not a Dem.

Kilburn is fill blown communist. So there goes that argument. Additionally I saw all the praise and defense of Big Techs recent censorship and deplatforming. A Spade is a Spade.

Originally Posted by KA24DESOneThree

And yet, you think we are. You think, like many conservatives do, that you're nailed to the cross as the salvation of the United States while the people you support are busy palletizing their money off the backs of Americans.

Call yourself whatever you want, doesn't change anything.

Originally Posted by KA24DESOneThree

Both sides are full of awful people. Both sides are full of people who have used others as stepping stones, who have used taxpayers as retribution for the transgressions of drunkards and addicts. Both sides are outmoded, undisciplined echo chambers of half-baked ideas.

What are you, a Doomer now?

I'm sorry that you think you're some genius non-partisan fence sitter. The reality is there is a definitive right and wrong in this world. Thier is good and there is evil. It's not a spectrum of "oh there's all these view points and their all true or the truth is in the middle".

That's being a spineless indecisive person with no moral fiber or backbone that just floats along with what we feels good in the moment.

You want to harp on the capital issue. Notice how a good 70-90% on the right condemned it and are appalled. But again, notice how you don't have 70-90% of the left condemning and calling in the national guard to Portland or all the other examples of government buildings and properties being attacked by leftists.

As for your "oh I voted for the superior candidate that nobody ever heard of", you either voted for Trump or you didn't, which means you voted for Biden.

Are we taking bets until how long before we start bombing brown kids again?

I could build a city out of the irony.

[kingkilburn]

If you think I'm a communist we should all be surprised you can even spell the word.

This us v them fantasy land shit you peddle in is precisely the shit that needs booted from public discourse. You can't coherently describe events or define terms. How the fuck could anyone take you seriously nevermind have any sort of fruitful discussion.

We need strong criminal libel laws for news and commentary. The well is poisoned.

[Corbic]

Originally Posted by deolio

They better hide those parts inside a bill for military spending

(Directed at KingBum since I see you quoted him)

I love how people act like they are living in the worst point of human history, devoid of hope and opportunity and cry about "The American Dream is Dead!" yet ironic they are living in the peak of human civilization and are part of the top 3% of the fucking world.

This is what happens when life is too damn easy.

Ya'll wanna see income inequity? Have you seen the middle ages?

American Dream? Jesus, move the goal posts much?

1950 -

Married with two kids in your 20's

Served in the military for 2 years

Moved out of New York, Detroit or Chicago because you didn't want to live in a cramp dirty city apartment.

Bought a suburban house - 2 bedroom, no garage, 1 bath, ~ 1,000 square feet.

No A/C

Coal or Oil Furnace

No Cable TV or Internet
Had to save to buy a Radio or TV
Party Phone Lines that cost a fortune
Tiny refrigerator
You had a wash sink and clothes line

Owned 1 Car (no AC, 11mpg, no safety, AM Radio)

Today because you can't buy a BMW i8, a 2,000 SqFT Loft in Manhattan or afford a 4 Bed Room house in Pala Alto on your 30hr part time job with $130k in voluntary student debt you are somehow oppressed.

Get fucked.

Pack your shit up, move to Iowa and get a job cleaning septic tanks or roofing and you'll easily afford a home, car and a family.

Pro-Hint: 40hrs a week is the minimum suggested, not maximum.

[kingkilburn]

And no I'm not going point by point with you on any of this. You'll move the goal posts and change definitions on the fly until people move on from the point you never had ground to stand on in the first place.

[kingkilburn]

In your feelings before you even saw my reply. lol

Never change, Corbic. Obviously people need an example for comparison.

[ixfxi]

Originally Posted by Corbic

(Directed at KingBum since I see you quoted him)

I love how people act like they are living in the worst point of human history, devoid of hope and opportunity and cry about "The American Dream is Dead!" yet ironic they are living in the peak of human civilization and are part of the top 3% of the fucking world.

Pro-Hint: 40hrs a week is the minimum suggested, not maximum.

Couldnt agree with you more. The problem is many people need to MOVE in order to get back to reality. Real jobs, whatever that may be. Shit, I worked till 2AM two days ago and 12AM yesterday. 8hr days would be HEAVEN.

Why did I see video of people dressed in black breaking windows in Oregon. What are they upset about now? I love how they coordinate their wardrobes, I gotta get some black attire too. Looks so menacing.

On a more important note, people still paying rent? Isnt Biden supposed to make this virus disappear?

[kingkilburn]

30-40 people conspired to drive Congress into the tunnels and gas them. As yet unnamed coconspirators inside the capitol fed information to paramilitary individuals.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/local...19d_story.html

This is exactly the sort of terrorism we fight abroad. Congrats to the Republican Party for driving us down this path.

[deolio]

Originally Posted by Corbic

I love how people act like they are living in the worst point of human history, devoid of hope and opportunity and cry about "The American Dream is Dead!" yet ironic they are living in the peak of human civilization and are part of the top 3% of the fucking world.

You're missing the point, which is that for a country in the top 3% (of what exactly idk) we could be doing a lot better.

Funny hearing you guys talk about how much you worked and then act like you aren't indoctrinated. "tHaT's bEcAusE We aReN't LAzY nEcK-bEarDeD IPA-dRinKiNg sNoWfLaKeS" Nah, it's because you buy into century old patriarchal bullshit. WORKING 65 HOURS A WEEK FOR THE CORPORATION AND GOING HOME TO MY SLAVE-WIFE WHO DOES ALL THE HOUSEKEEPING AND CHILD REARING REALLY MAKES ME FEEL LIKE A MAN!

Shit's old and corny.

[Corbic]

Originally Posted by deolio

You're missing the point, which is that for a country in the top 3% (of what exactly idk)

Of the world. You realize there is 7 billion people out there. Billions live in absolute destitute making less then $800 a year. Most without clean water, any forum of Healthcare including aspirin and under murderous authoritarian regimes.
Not getting a PS5 and some LeBrons is the least of their concerns.

Originally Posted by deolio

we could be doing a lot better.

But that would require people to work rather then bitch about statues and burn business while demanding the "rich" pay for their worthless degrees in garbage.....

Originally Posted by deolio

Funny hearing you guys talk about how much you worked and then act like you aren't indoctrinated. "tHaT's bEcAusE We aReN't LAzY nEcK-bEarDeD IPA-dRinKiNg sNoWfLaKeS" Nah, it's because you buy into century old patriarchal bullshit. WORKING 65 HOURS A WEEK

Those are rookie numbers, gotta get that in the tipple digits. You think anyone worth a damn in history spend half their life watching TV and playing video games?

[QUOTE=deolio;6405640FOR THE CORPORATION AND GOING HOME TO MY SLAVE-WIFE WHO DOES ALL THE HOUSEKEEPING AND CHILD REARING REALLY MAKES ME FEEL LIKE A MAN!

Shit's old and corny.[/QUOTE]

Sounding a little bitter there. Why not start your own business and invest in yourself?

You don't need $100k in college debt to buy a $10k Tow Truck and start your own business. You don't need a trade school to get a Harbor Freight welder and learn to fab. You don't need tech school to learn to code.

Fuck dude, go lift some weights and learn to act. What one man can do, so can another.

https://youtu.be/u_ktRTWMX3M

[KA24DESOneThree]

Originally Posted by Corbic

Kilburn is fill blown communist. So there goes that argument. Additionally I saw all the praise and defense of Big Techs recent censorship and deplatforming. A Spade is a Spade.

What? Do you think Democrats are communists? thefuck.avi


Call yourself whatever you want, doesn't change anything.

Actually, it does- because words matter. Or would you say that the Constitution is just a bunch of stuff calling the country whatever the Framers wanted and that it didn't mean anything?

What are you, a Doomer now?

I'm sorry that you think you're some genius non-partisan fence sitter. The reality is there is a definitive right and wrong in this world. Thier is good and there is evil. It's not a spectrum of "oh there's all these view points and their all true or the truth is in the middle".

That's being a spineless indecisive person with no moral fiber or backbone that just floats along with what we feels good in the moment.

Yes, because your being conservative means that you fight for what is right. According to your narrow-ass mindset.

You want to harp on the capital issue. Notice how a good 70-90% on the right condemned it and are appalled. But again, notice how you don't have 70-90% of the left condemning and calling in the national guard to Portland or all the other examples of government buildings and properties being attacked by leftists.

See, this is where confirmation bias confirmation bias comes into play.

As for your "oh I voted for the superior candidate that nobody ever heard of", you either voted for Trump or you didn't, which means you voted for Biden.

Um, nope... is your attention span so short that you didn't read past the first two lines on your ballot?

Are we taking bets until how long before we start bombing brown kids again?

You mean like Donny boy? More than quadruple the drone strikes in Som_alia. Increased deaths in Yemen. He literally said, "The other thing with the terrorists is you have to take out their families, when you get these terrorists, you have to take out their families."

So did you care when it was Trump or do you care more now that the Bad Guy's in the Oval Office?

I could build a city out of the irony.

Nah dude, you're building a life out of irony.

I see you're still peddling the same "you can make a great living for yourself if you just pick up and move halfway across the country to some fucking boring flyover country podunk town and you can make enough shoveling shit at the local shitporium to buy a nice house in a nice part of a fucking boring flyover country podunk town and get yourself a nice girl and have yourself a nice family and you'll go to church and everything will be so American and enjoyable."

How is someone supposed to get to Iowa or Kansas and make their first month's rent with the $400 in savings they have? If they get a flat on their way, they'll arrive in Zeroelevationchangeville already in debt.

Still with your ooh-rah everyone needs to serve in the military bullshit too.

I keep telling myself I'm done with you and then you have to go and be closed-minded a little harder and all of a sudden I feel like Carradine and I tighten the belt around my neck a little tighter to feel that rush. One of these days I'ma get banned because I forgot my safe word and said no no things to you. Ya basic.

[Corbic]

Originally Posted by KA24DESOneThree

I see you're still peddling the same "you can make a great living for yourself if you just pick up and move halfway across the country to some fucking boring flyover country podunk town and you can make enough shoveling shit at the local shitporium to buy a nice house in a nice part of a fucking boring flyover country podunk town and get yourself a nice girl and have yourself a nice family and you'll go to church and everything will be so American and enjoyable."



How is someone supposed to get to Iowa or Kansas and make their first month's rent with the $400 in savings they have? If they get a flat on their way, they'll arrive in Zeroelevationchangeville already in debt.



Still with your ooh-rah everyone needs to serve in the military bullshit too.



I keep telling myself I'm done with you and then you have to go and be closed-minded a little harder and all of a sudden I feel like Carradine and I tighten the belt around my neck a little tighter to feel that rush. One of these days I'ma get banned because I forgot my safe word and said no no things to you. Ya basic.

Bruh.

People literally have been traveling across the world, not even knowing the language, with only the clothes on their back and $15 in their pocket to come here and make a living.

So sorry you're two stupid or lazy to figure out how to ditch LA with $1800/M rent for a roach motel to make it to Grand Haven Michigan to live in a mansion under the same budget.

So sorry your too good to actually learn a skill, trade or offer a service that's actually of value to community.


Broken record of excuses.

[Corbic]

Originally Posted by KA24DESOneThree

Still with your ooh-rah everyone needs to serve in the military bullshit too.

Again, who the fuck told you life is easy and doesn't require sacrifice?

My statement of the American Dream and 2 years was by the mid 50's practically everyone served because of the draft.

If you are really jobless, trapped in Cali and have $400 and are under 30, fuck man, join the military.

If your not retarded you could save up $50k in cash, get out in 4 years with some marketable skills and move to somewhere with a good credit score and plenty of options.

Join the Navy, then go into the Merchant Marines making $100k a year working 8 months on 4 months off while seeing the world.


You call me narrow minded? *scoff*

[kingkilburn]

You guys are falling for his shit like you have been for years. Hook, line, and sinker.

You don't have to justify yourselves or entertain his beliefs, assuming he actually believes what he says.

[kingkilburn]

You've got him shaping the whole narrative, leaving you to react to whatever disingenuous bomb he drops next.


Rather than having flyover states with nothing to offer and handful of high cost cities we could have high speed internet as a right and an international high speed rail connecting all these places. Why shouldn't we create hundreds of thousands of jobs completely overhauling our stilted ww2 to cold war era infrastructure and society? As long as our deficit doesn't outpace inflation and GDP no cost is too high.

[ixfxi]

corbic is the voice of reason in a sea of stupidity here.

the state of california is FUCKED and beyond repair. if you think it makes sense to stay here, you guys are nuts. everyone is jumping ship for a reason, me included.

[deolio]

^Cool. You won't be missed.

Originally Posted by Corbic

Of the world. You realize there is 7 billion people out there. Billions live in absolute destitute making less then $800 a year...

You aren't listening to what I'm saying. I get it, we have it good and I agree, but why wouldn't you want it to be better?

The supposed shining city on the hill I see looks a lot better for everyone in it rather than just the elite who lucked, sucked, and fucked their way to the top.

Originally Posted by Corbic

But that would require people to work rather then bitch about statues and burn business while demanding the "rich" pay for their worthless degrees in garbage.....

A lot of people are working and tearing down the statues. Because people can be more than one thing.

I don't think there should be student debt forgiveness. However I do think education should be a lottttt fucking cheaper and the government could help with that. An investment in education (k-12, college, trade school, etc) is basically an investment in the economy. Having a better education helps regardless of you driving a tow truck or running a fortune 500.

Originally Posted by Corbic

Those are rookie numbers, gotta get that in the tipple digits. You think anyone worth a damn in history spend half their life watching TV and playing video games?

Is Roger Ebert worth a damn?

Originally Posted by Corbic

Sounding a little bitter there. Why not start your own business and invest in yourself?

I have 3 and I do well. Sup.

Originally Posted by Corbic

You don't need $100k in college debt to buy a $10k Tow Truck and start your own business. You don't need a trade school to get a Harbor Freight welder and learn to fab. You don't need tech school to learn to code.

Fuck dude, go lift some weights and learn to act. What one man can do, so can another.

Not everyone wants to break their backs, turn into an alcoholic, and die of lung cancer at 45.

Went into more debt bootstrapping my ass into the game after college than I did while in college. And while my degree has little to nothing to do with any of my businesses, most peoples do. A college degree is necessary for a fuckton of jobs. Do you really want to go see a "doctor" with no med school training? An accountant with no CPA? A VC with no MBA? What the fuck are you even talking about? What is your issue with college? Inferiority complex much?


Seeing things in black and white doesn't mean you're decisive, it just means you lack tact and the ability to understand complex situations.

[kingkilburn]

Originally Posted by ixfxi

everyone is jumping ship for a reason, me included.

Everyone is jumping ship over income tax not realizing that the places they're going generate revenue through property taxes far higher than ours instead.

Good riddance.

[kingkilburn]

The investments in education are just that, investments. The smarter and more capable our society is the greater the return is. Investment in education and art is how American primacy was born. The feds dumped a near unimaginable amount of money after ww2. NASA and DARPA are basically still that only they're overwhelmingly staffed by individuals from countries investing more in education than we are.