Kinugawa 20g turbo review

[Tom N]

Originally Posted by Livinstrong

Interesting. I'm curious how it would perform compared to a BorgWarner of similar size

I am not aware of a Borg Warner that is available as a bolt on turbo.

[Tom N]

Originally Posted by new2sr20

Tom- Wish I would have known you were looking for a 20G. I have a Forced Performance 20G they made for the SR a while back with 3000 miles on the turbo.

I wish you knew also. Would have definitely been interested.

[Tom N]

Shortly after putting the turbo on I noticed a odd notice when I would shut the car off that sounded like a wheel rubbing. I did some inspecting and could not find any evidence of that. There was no shaft play and I only heard it when the car shut off for a few seconds. Turbo performed like it should and showed no signs of being bad a side from this noise.
Here's a video



I contact Kinugawa with my concern. They send me a new chra 2 day priority with a shipping label to return mine. My experience with them customer service so far has been 100% top notch.
Anyways I get the chra and swap it in. And this is the result



I am a bit baffled now. Well I can believe 2 are making the same exact noise so I start banging my head against the wall trying to figure it and I finally did.
The noise is not the turbo. Anyone care to guess what it is?

[Livinstrong]

Originally Posted by Tom N

I am not aware of a Borg Warner that is available as a bolt on turbo.

I was more curious about similar sized turbos in this price range than interchangeability.

For the unknown noise, I've heard that before with the spool down on ball bearing turbos, but never with journal bearing turbos. This occurred even after y swapped out CHRA's? Really impressed with their customer support regardless.

[Tom N]

Originally Posted by Livinstrong

I was more curious about similar sized turbos in this price range than interchangeability.

For the unknown noise, I've heard that before with the spool down on ball bearing turbos, but never with journal bearing turbos. This occurred even after y swapped out CHRA's? Really impressed with their customer support regardless.

The sound turns out to not be coming from the turbo at all.

[ultimateirving]

Originally Posted by Tom N

The sound turns out to not be coming from the turbo at all.

Tom does the sound kinda sound like metal screeching or barely scraping together? I had an issue that i swore was the turbo but i found it only occured after i put the new turbo on because it didnt have a spot to connect the front ofthe T off of the valve cover, so i blocked it instead and thats when the horrible whining started.
After removing the plug and rerouting the lines thru my catch can the sound went away

Could you post a picture of the turbo side, THe whole valve cover and exhaust manifold visible plz

[Tom N]

You can hear the noise in the 2 videos I posted.
The factory line from valve cover to turbo intake pipe is still connected.

[Tom N]

I would bet money on the noise being the throw out bearing.

[Tom N]

Little update to this. I hurt the motor right before Christmas and got a new one built and installed about a month ago. New motor for some reason wasn't feeding oil to the turbo from the factory location. I figured this out after the car had idled for about 20 minutes, changed oil and took it for a drive. I wasn't getting on it, was just bringing up the rpms then letting the engine drag itself down producing vacuum. I noticed the car wasn't really producing any boost when bringing the rpms up. So I tried giving it some throttle and still no real boost. So I went strait home. This totaled 9 miles of driving. I figured out the stolid feed location on the block wasn't putting out oil. So the turbo idled for 20 minutes and drive for 9 miles with no oil going to it. I was sure it would be toast. Well I'm sure it is hurt but not ruined. So far that's not the case. New motor and existing turbo has about 2k miles on it now including a day at the dyno and some track runs. I have to say I'm rather impressed the turbo wasn't ruined.

Onto new dyno results.
On wastegate pressure ( 14psi ) with minimal tuning at that level it made 356/316
At 22psi it made 425 don't remember the TQ. we had to stop there as I started getting valve float. Forgot to get a shot of the dyno graph at the last boost level in my disappointment of having to stop there and back the boost off some.

Wastegate dyno sheet

[TheRealSy90]

Glad to see an update finally, did you ever figure out what blocked the oil feed on your engine?

[Tom N]

Originally Posted by TheRealSy90

Glad to see an update finally, did you ever figure out what blocked the oil feed on your engine?

No I did not. Just kept with feeding the turbo from the oil filter housing.

[Tom N]

Little update to the thread.

I got the new motor back together a few weeks ago. Previous motor had a little mishap and dropped a valve in cylinder 4.

We out the car back on the dyno last week and found two issues. Issue one is the turbine wheel has damage to it. I don't know why I never checked it after the last motor dropped a valve. Obviously motor pieces went through it while leaving the motor via exhaust. Took the whole turbo set up off the old motor when pulling the motor and simply set it aside and forgot about it. Other problem is cylinder 2 is pressurizing the coolant system. Confirmed this with a leak down test that produced bubbling in the radiator on that cylinder.

Anyways. To my surprise the turbo while damaged still produced good numbers. We didn't notice there was a problem with compression getting into the coolant till we turned the boost up.

After pulling the head to fix the issue and taking the turbo apart to look at it I notice the turbine wheel was bent up from motor pieces. Surprising after everything this turbo has been put through it still has no play in it and made 454/441 at 24/25 psi

Should have the head back soon and ordering a new 20g. Going to try a billet one this time and see how it compares tot he standard cast wheel.

[Tom N]

Picture of the turbine wheel. It's seen better days.

[WheelWhore]

Seen these on ebay and always looked away. Glad to see a review!

[TheRealSy90]

Any updates on this setup?

[Tom N]

Originally Posted by TheRealSy90

Any updates on this setup?

Sort of. After the turbine housing was damaged by valve pieces I decied to move on to a billet 20g so I ordered a new chra with the same turbine wheel but a billet 7 blade 20g wheel.

My results of a back to back comparison of a td06sl2 20g with a standard cast compressor wheel vs a billet 7 blade compressor wheel.
The billet wheel is a bit taller but the same exducer/inducer as a standard 20g.
You can see how much taller the 7 blade wheel is in the photos.

Took the car to the dyno with the 7 blade billet 20g.
On waste gate pressure which is 14.6psi on the Blitz EBC ( shows about 1.5psi less on a autometer boost gauge ) it made 381hp
The previous cast 20g made 356 at the same boost level.

At 24psi on the EBC it made 450hp. It was starting to break up though do to spark blow out so had to stop there. Need to put in new plugs and gap them down some.
Took 27-28psi to make 450 on the cast 20g.

This was done on a S15 SR20DET

Comparison showing height difference between cast 20g and billet 7 blade.

[Tom N]

Dyno comparisons. Both at 15psi

Cast 20g


Billet 20g
Pulled strong all the way to 8k rpms

[TheRealSy90]

Looks good and making great numbers, can't wait to get my Greddy 20g kit installed. Also been trying to sell my spare greddy t3 20g lol.

[nissantuner_s13]

I just want to say thanks for keeping updates on this thred! This info has helped me out a lot! Thanks man.

[Member]

Just tuned a friends car last night stock cams with a greddy 20g at 22.4 psi it made 468whp SAE corrected. Not sure if you saw my last post on the 2867 thread either but if I went by STD correction as your graphs show my setup would have made roughly 438whp with a 53.5mm turbine wheel vs. your 60mm turbine. So I wouldn't say there is anything wrong with my setup.

[Tom N]

Originally Posted by Member

Just tuned a friends car last night stock cams with a greddy 20g at 22.4 psi it made 468whp SAE corrected. Not sure if you saw my last post on the 2867 thread either but if I went by STD correction as your graphs show my setup would have made roughly 438whp with a 53.5mm turbine wheel vs. your 60mm turbine. So I wouldn't say there is anything wrong with my setup.

Not sure what exactly your comparing but there's more to a turbo than just the inducer of a turbine but my turbo is a 54.1mm.
And it made 460 hp on pump gas with 2 cylinders that were low on compression. One was 110 the other 120. Cylinder 3 and 4 were at proper compression.
i am currently building a new bottom end I guarantee you it will hit 500hp and with out E85.

[Member]

Not sure if you have looked at your turbo's specs. But your turbine inducer is 61mm the exducer is 54mm. And I don't doubt it is capable of 500whp. It should be easily achieved at 25psi. However your turbo is still not comparable to A GTX2867R.

[Tom N]

Originally Posted by Member

Not sure if you have looked at your turbo's specs. But your turbine inducer is 61mm the exducer is 54mm. And I don't doubt it is capable of 500whp. It should be easily achieved at 25psi. However your turbo is still not comparable to A GTX2867R.

What matters is what they can flow not just the one end of a turbine diameter.
The two turbos are not very far off in airflow.
Gtx2867r is rated at 48lb/min
What exactly do you think a 20g is rated at?

Yes I tend to forget the inducer is the larger wheel on the tubine which is opposite of compressor.
The gtx2857r has a exducer of 53.9 ( not 53.5 ) and the 20g has a exducer of 54.1 on the turbine.
Huge difference there. A whole .2mm
But again all that really matter is what it will flow and the gtx flows 48lb/min
Go ahead and look up the 20g.

[Member]

I am very aware of the 20g's compressor flow. But the fact that you are missing is that the BIG side of the GTX2867R turbine is sorry 53.9mm. But that is the BIG SIDE! They are very different.

[Tom N]

Originally Posted by Member

I am very aware of the 20g's compressor flow. But the fact that you are missing is that the BIG side of the GTX2867R turbine is sorry 53.9mm. But that is the BIG SIDE! They are very different.

From what I found online that's the exducer which is the small side on a turbine.
Measure it for yourself.
Which by the way is what a 20g flows. 47-48lb/min.

Not sure why your so focused on the turbine exducer anyways.
20g flows 47.4lb/min
GTX2867r flows 48lb/min
Explain to me how these turbos are not comparable in performance again???

[Member]

I have one right in front of me. It's 53.9 on the big side "inducer". And about 46mm on the small side "exducer". You don't know what you are talking about man. And the Compressor flow has nothing to do with the exhaust or "turbine" side of the turbo. Looks like you need to do a little research.

[Member]

And if you don't understand why I'm focused on the flow of the exhaust housing and wheel then you obviously don't know very much about turbo's. Or why a TD06 20G and a GTX2867R are very different turbos.

[Tom N]

Originally Posted by Member

I have one right in front of me. It's 53.9 on the big side "inducer". And about 46mm on the small side "exducer". You don't know what you are talking about man. And the Compressor flow has nothing to do with the exhaust or "turbine" side of the turbo. Looks like you need to do a little research.

I did and saw this. If it's wrong so be. Doesn't change that that they flow the same.
http://realstreetperformance.com/Pro...rbine-Hsg.html

Not sure why your so hung up on the size of one side of one wheel. More to a turbo than that. You know the right??? You know the gtx2867 has a larger compressor wheel than the 20g right? Which again is meaningless by itself. What matter is what it can flow.

Both flow about the same 48lb/min of air so please once again I ask how are they not comparable performing turbos?
Or do you just not want them to be for personal reasons?

[Tom N]

Don't be mad people are telling you your dyno numbers on E85 are not impressive. If you disagree then thats ok. No need to get all defensive. Not everyone can be fast and build fast cars.

You go ahead and keep telling yourself two turbos that flow almost the same airflow are not comparable at all.

[Member]

Because the limiting factor of a GTX2867R is the amount the turbine side can flow. Which limits top end power. But because of its small size it has a much smaller rotating mass which helps it spool up and build boost much sooner. I am very aware that the compressor side flows very close to the same amount. But like I said you are the one who does not understand how a turbo works. The reason I'm trying to explain this to you is because you are trying to prove an incorrect point. All of the information you need is out there. Search for a while. You will find the answers you are looking for. And until you do stop spreading incorrect info.