At last, depowered the rack.

[Bigsyke]

I assume their suspension setups are different. Guessing from the difference in resistance just from the ride height varrying from the front/rear (when I only installed the front springs) I guess its possible to make it driftable.

[GSXRJJordan]

Originally Posted by Bigsyke

I assume their suspension setups are different. Guessing from the difference in resistance just from the ride height varrying from the front/rear (when I only installed the front springs) I guess its possible to make it driftable.

There's a reason why every professional drift car that can have power steering, does. You'll never drift "better" without it, and my feedback is that it's damned-near impossible to initiate correct with the ebrake without it.

[Driftastic]

This post was very helpful!

I have been contemplating going manual with my rack cause currently the car is a shell and thats just one more thing to worry about working properly and i love the feel of the road with a manual steering setup. However the primary function of the car will be drifting so it probably would not be the best idea but maybe ill make a spare manual rack and try it out to see just how bad it is.

[Howlermonkey]

One thing that can suffer from parking lot driving with de-powered rack is your steering wheel itself.

I de-powered the rack on my Z31 and the effort in parking eventually caused my Z32 steering wheel padding to separate from the rim underneath netting me a twisty feeling wheel.

That sucked.

As other people have mentioned, the U-joints now are being used a bit harder and the rubber coupler found on the Z31 inside the tube that goes through the firewall will eventually hog out from the extra loading and you will end up with play in the steering.

[Bigsyke]

Then again, Ive never drifted the car, ive broke the rear end loose a few times when I had 15x6's, however now I have 18x10's and cant break the rear end loose for anything. Steering effort is slightly increased with the massive fucking tires, but not by much.

I do wish I made a fitting so I can regrease the rack, now if only someone knew what the optimal type of grease would be. I used some amsoil, forgot the type but it was blue.

[GSXRJJordan]

Originally Posted by Bigsyke

Then again, Ive never drifted the car, ive broke the rear end loose a few times when I had 15x6's, however now I have 18x10's and cant break the rear end loose for anything. Steering effort is slightly increased with the massive fucking tires, but not by much.

I do wish I made a fitting so I can regrease the rack, now if only someone knew what the optimal type of grease would be. I used some amsoil, forgot the type but it was blue.

I'd imagine you'd want something high temp (so it doesn't get hot and "crusty"), but not too thick... black molybdenum grease? I just thought about it because that's what I'm having to pick up so I can grease my input shaft bearing.

[projectRDM]

Originally Posted by Matej

Wish the feedback wasn't so divided. Some people claim they love drifting with no power steering, while others say it is impossible.

I love how everyone assumes that every Schassis mod is meant for drifting. There needs to be separate threads I guess, because not everyone drifts their cars. Those who actually track or autocross like the feel of a depowered rack. I love it, it's very easy to drive without the effort needed from a fluid filled dead rack like people have done in the past. But then again, I don't drift, so I wouldn't know how it feels in that situation. Nor would I care.

[g81981]

Any more people experience/experiment with this method?

[Matej]

Originally Posted by projectRDM

I love how everyone assumes that every Schassis mod is meant for drifting. There needs to be separate threads I guess, because not everyone drifts their cars. Those who actually track or autocross like the feel of a depowered rack. I love it, it's very easy to drive without the effort needed from a fluid filled dead rack like people have done in the past. But then again, I don't drift, so I wouldn't know how it feels in that situation. Nor would I care.

Not sure where you saw me assuming that all S-chassis mods are meant for drifting. I don't even care about the ones that are.
Although I see how my post could be misinterpreted, but I was referring to feedback from people who do or have tried to drift with no power steering.

Anyway, I finally drove an S13 with just the lines unhooked, and it was not bad at all. I can't wait to do this.

[ixfxi]

Originally Posted by Matej

Not sure where you saw me assuming that all S-chassis mods are meant for drifting. I don't even care about the ones that are.
Although I see how my post could be misinterpreted, but I was referring to feedback from people who do or have tried to drift with no power steering.

Anyway, I finally drove an S13 with just the lines unhooked, and it was not bad at all. I can't wait to do this.

thats not a manual rack, dude. you're still PUSHING (and pulling!!!) all that fluid through the rack.

drain the rack, remove the lines, throw everything in the garbage... then you've got a manual setup. just be fucking sure that the rack is empty of almost all fluid and youre set.

[Otto347]

Finally got mine finished up, welded the holes closed on the rack and am going to put a grease fitting some where to keep it lubed....

[owner240]

^Make sure to take even more pix of your process

Good job.

It's really helpful when people do step by step photo tuts.

Oh and do post your experience

[owner240]

For those interested in a true manual rack lo and behold:

Interest Check: Performance true manual rack for s13 and s14: 240SX Forum / 180SX Forum / Silvia Forum: Nissan Forums / Infiniti Forums - NICOclub

[ixfxi]

FYI...... i finally got a chance to work on the front end of my undercarriage today and that meant dropping the steering rack after near 5 years of manual steering.

i took most of the rack apart and everything inside looks perfect, I was kinda thinking that years of use without grease/fluid would cause some wear, but nope.. it was all clean. there was still a tiny bit of fluid left in the rack, which kinda surprised me... i turned the rack real quick and almost got a facial of fuckin power steering fluid, fucking sick.. i know. one side of my garage looks like it got nut on by peter north!


jokes aside, i still need 2 more spanners before i can remove my tie rod ends... a 22mm and a 41mm... gaddamn who uses wrenches this big? not me.

it appears all the pics from this thread are history now, which sucks balls. i'll update in the next week or so with updates.

i am also working on grabbing a hicas rack and comparing the differences. i think it will be nice to have a close-ratio rack. it'll be a bitch normally but should be real nice when up to speed.

mike

[onepuff]

Originally Posted by ixfxi

FYI...... i finally got a chance to work on the front end of my undercarriage today and that meant dropping the steering rack after near 5 years of manual steering.

i took most of the rack apart and everything inside looks perfect, I was kinda thinking that years of use without grease/fluid would cause some wear, but nope.. it was all clean. there was still a tiny bit of fluid left in the rack, which kinda surprised me... i turned the rack real quick and almost got a facial of fuckin power steering fluid, fucking sick.. i know. one side of my garage looks like it got nut on by peter north!


jokes aside, i still need 2 more spanners before i can remove my tie rod ends... a 22mm and a 41mm... gaddamn who uses wrenches this big? not me.

it appears all the pics from this thread are history now, which sucks balls. i'll update in the next week or so with updates.

i am also working on grabbing a hicas rack and comparing the differences. i think it will be nice to have a close-ratio rack. it'll be a bitch normally but should be real nice when up to speed.

mike

Just use a couple crescent wrenches.

[mattro]

Originally Posted by s13dan

Um the gears are designed to have pressure. So under cornering you will have to fight the full weight of the car. --Watch your thumbs-- For drifting,if the car wants to snap back you better let it.

thats what im saying. my car didnt come with ps and ive damn near took me whole arm off!

[Bigsyke]

Originally Posted by owner240

For those interested in a true manual rack lo and behold:

Interest Check: Performance true manual rack for s13 and s14: 240SX Forum / 180SX Forum / Silvia Forum: Nissan Forums / Infiniti Forums - NICOclub

im curious how ahmed thinks a custom rack will make it easier to turn?

The OE rack outside of the car has almost no resistance.

Its the S chassis suspension setup which makes it difficult.

I have 9.5" fronts, its just as easy to turn as 6" fronts.


I still have mine vented to help with high speed windage.

[ZAKU]

It's been a while since I first asked, but I finally swapped in my de-powered rack this weekend and so far I have mixed reviews.

The Good:

- KA-E alternator brackets works great, I love the one belt setup and all the open room in the engine bay.
- Road feel is perfect, just like my old manual rack honda

The Bad:
- Even after removing the tensioner spring, it just feels too tight. It feels great at first but after a 1/8ths turn of the steering wheel it tightens up very quickly. It's manageable during daily driving and low speed turns but it really feels like the wheels are fighting me and want to straighten out. Tight u-turns are "fun" to say the least.

The most frustrating part is I removed the tensioner spring, pulled the dust boot and tightened the adjuster until the rack stopped rotating and it was WAY too stiff. I've backed the adjuster off about 180 degrees and I can see the rack rotate if I put a wrench on it and it's still uncomfortably stiff.

I'm sure I can get the rack to loosen up by backing the adjuster off even more, but I'm already worried it's too far back.

Either way I'll wait for my alignment tomorrow too see if it changes anything.

[Bigsyke]

You shouldve removed everything inside the adjusting hole, and just used the plug to seal the area. You dont need the tensioner, you should have no slop if your suspension is safe.

The tensioner just controls the drag on getting the rack back to 0, and is not needed on a non-power setup.

I did this to my truck and its much more preferable, even on a nissan pathfinder.

Maybe you need to get used to it, or you did something wrong/missed something.

Use a grease with Moly in it, like redline.

You should post what you used to make the One belt setup? just the alternator bracket?

[ZAKU]

Originally Posted by Bigsyke

The tensioner just controls the drag on getting the rack back to 0, and is not needed on a non-power setup.

Is that really all it does? I thought that it also helped support the shaft on the drivers side of the rack, like how the big aluminum end cap supports that passenger side.

Originally Posted by Bigsyke

Maybe you need to get used to it, or you did something wrong/missed something.

After the alignment it did feel better, even though they only needed to adjust the toe. Maybe I was a little too harsh at first.

It also doesn't help that my last car was an EF Civic with manual steering and the front sway removed, that probably has me a little biased.

Originally Posted by Bigsyke

Use a grease with Moly in it, like redline.

Redline wasn't available so I used this; Red 'N' Tacky Grease : Lucas Oil

Originally Posted by Bigsyke

You should post what you used to make the One belt setup? just the alternator bracket?

I followed the guide on ka-t.org you posted earlier. A squeaking has suddenly developed so I'll be double checking it in the morning but it seems good so far.

[TerminalSamurai]

Bringing this back from the dead, again.

Any feedback on the difference between the hicas and non hicas rack?

I'm interested in doing this, I used to have Honda EC1, and I loved the manual steering feel.

[TurboSE]

Alot of debate on this....weekend driver/straight-line track car w/10" wide front wheels and an RB26....opinions?

[obsolete]

is there a way to take this piece off other than torx socket?

[Bigsyke]

The picture you posted is the tensioner, and there is no torx, only a 12mm head, and a locking stop nut. Pack that area and the rest of the rack with a synthetic grease that is 5% moly. Mobil1 is not recomended. For cheap this may work and you can get it locally.



The gear shaft housing uses 3 torx bolts, I hammered a small 8-9mm socket on them IIRC.

I run 10" fronts. Pretty tough to turn at a very slow speed regardless of how you have your rack setup. At about 5mph I dont notice it much.

[Bigsyke]

Obsolete whats behind there should be a tension spring to keep the shaft pressed against the gear. I found out today that you do infact need that. Its supposed to have a spring, 3 shims and a white tensioner.

I had a rough vibration when turning at high speeds, it was because there was slack on the pinion shaft and the gear. When I reinstalled the tensioner the steering response significantly improved and the vibrations stopped. I had it set just right to give just enough tension, but not to disallow the steering from centering itself.

[TurboSE]

I'm more the visual type...and there seem to bee a few different opinions on how to do this...anybody care to share exactly what they removed/modified using the page from the FSM?

I think I've got the basic idea from the Miata site, but I'd just like some clarification.

[youngkadafi]

Originally Posted by TurboSE

I'm more the visual type...and there seem to bee a few different opinions on how to do this...anybody care to share exactly what they removed/modified using the page from the FSM?

I think I've got the basic idea from the Miata site, but I'd just like some clarification.

Remove;

-Rack seal ring on rack assembly

Plug the 2X fittings on the gear housing, Or loop them with a hose.

Make sure you remove the Pinion rack housing assembly with a torx socket, Pack the entire rack (everythign) with grease containing 5% molybdenum. Cap all fittings on rear housing assembly.

Make sure no dust or moisture can get in the rack.
Done.

[TurboSE]

Originally Posted by youngkadafi

Remove;

-Rack seal ring on rack assembly

Plug the 2X fittings on the gear housing, Or loop them with a hose.

Make sure you remove the Pinion rack housing assembly with a torx socket, Pack the entire rack (everythign) with grease containing 5% molybdenum. Cap all fittings on rear housing assembly.

Make sure no dust or moisture can get in the rack.
Done.

cool, so the only thing to remove is the rack ring seal...easy as that. Nice. Thanks

[lflkajfj12123]

Originally Posted by Matej

Not sure where you saw me assuming that all S-chassis mods are meant for drifting. I don't even care about the ones that are.
Although I see how my post could be misinterpreted, but I was referring to feedback from people who do or have tried to drift with no power steering.

Anyway, I finally drove an S13 with just the lines unhooked, and it was not bad at all. I can't wait to do this.

Pretty sure Simba crashed his car drifting without powered rack. He said its very hard to turn the wheel when it hits full lock, IIRC. Power steering is a must for drifting.

[Bigsyke]

Yea you clearly wouldnt want to do this on a drift car. A street driven car is fine. I did it because its easier to tune the suspension when the PS isnt dampening the wheel.