Bush trumps Congress; Moves first on drilling

[nevaland9]

Just saw this on yahoo and thought it was interesting. Hopefully Congress follows suite and we can get some cheaper fucking gas!

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080714/ap_on_go_pr_wh/bush

WASHINGTON - Putting pressure on congressional Democrats to back more exploration for oil, President Bush on Monday lifted an executive ban on offshore drilling that has stood since his father was president.

But the move, by itself, will do nothing unless Congress acts as well.

There are two prohibitions on offshore drilling, one imposed by Congress and another by executive order signed by the first President Bush in 1990. The current president, trying to ease market tensions and boost supply, called last month for Congress to lift its prohibition before he did so himself.

"The only thing standing between the American people and these vast oil resources is action from the U.S. Congress," Bush said in a statement in the Rose Garden. "Now the ball is squarely in Congress' court."

Bush criticized Congress for failing to lift its own ban on offshore drilling.

"For years, my administration has been calling on Congress to expand domestic oil production," Bush said. "Unfortunately, Democrats on Capitol Hill have rejected virtually every proposal. And now Americans are paying at the pump."

Sen. John McCain, the presumptive Republican presidential nominee, called Bush's move "a very important signal" and said his Democratic rival, Sen. Barack Obama, should drop his opposition to offshore drilling.

Congressional Democrats, joined by some GOP lawmakers from coastal states, have opposed lifting the prohibition that has barred energy companies from waters along both the East and West coasts and in the eastern Gulf of Mexico. A succession of presidents, from Bush's father — George H.W. Bush — to Bill Clinton, have sided against drilling in these waters, as has Congress each year for 27 years. Their goal has to been to protect beaches and coastal states' tourism economies.

"Once again, the oilman in the White House is echoing the demands of Big Oil," said House Speaker Nancy Pelosi. "The Bush plan is a hoax. It will neither reduce gas prices nor increase energy independence. It just gives millions more acres to the same companies that are sitting on nearly 68 million acres of public lands and coastal areas."

"This proposal is something you'd expect from an oil company CEO, not the president of the United States," said Sen. Barbara Boxer, D-Calif., chairwoman of the Senate Environment Committee. "The president is taking special-interest government to a new level and threatening our thriving coastal economy."

Environmental groups, too, blasted Bush's move.

"President Bush has once again ignored the wise precedent set by his father and taken reckless action that has neither hope of reducing gas prices nor concern for long-term consequences," said Gene Karpinski, president of The League of Conservation Voters.

Asked if Bush's action alone will lead to more oil drilling, White House press secretary Dana Perino said, "In terms of allowing more exploration to go forward? No, it does not."

The president, in his final months of office, has turned to increased oil exploration among other options amid record gas-prices. None would have immediate impact on prices at the pump, according to White House officials, who say there is no quick fix. But starting action now would help, they say.

Bush's proposal echoes a call by Republican presidential candidate, Sen. John McCain, to open the Outer Continental Shelf for exploration. Democrat Barack Obama has opposed the idea and instead argued for helping consumers with a second economic stimulus package including energy rebates, as well as stepped up efforts to develop alternative fuels and more fuel-efficient automobiles.

"If offshore drilling would provide short-term relief at the pump or a long-term strategy for energy independence, it would be worthy of our consideration, regardless of the risks," spokesman Bill Burton said in a statement. "But most experts, even within the Bush administration, concede it would do neither. It would merely prolong the failed energy policies we have seen from Washington for thirty years."

Congressional Democrats have rejected the push to lift the drilling moratorium, accusing the president of hoping the U.S. can drill its way out a problem.

Bush says offshore drilling could yield up to 18 billion barrels of oil over time, although it would take years for production to start. Bush also says offshore drilling would take pressure off prices over time. In addition, the president has proposed opening the Arctic National Wildlife Refuge for drilling, lifting restrictions on oil shale leasing in the Green River Basin of Colorado, Utah and Wyoming and easing the regulatory process to expand oil refining capacity.

Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell, R-Ky., and other lawmakers have backed legislation to allow offshore exploration. Their measure would pursue other ways to expand energy sources, too.

"Now the only thing standing between consumers at the pump and the increased American energy they are demanding is the Democrat leadership in Congress," McConnell said. "We should act and act now."

[azndoc]

Seems a little sketchy trying to get this to pass months before he steps out of office.

[DohcKA]

bush is an oil exec all he sees is dollars

[hitman]

ya bro! fuck nature! lets save 5$ on a tank of gas!

[drift freaq]

Originally Posted by hitman

ya bro! fuck nature! lets save 5$ on a tank of gas!

You're an idiot, Its about fucking time. Your going to destroy the financial well being of the Country for the sake of a very minimal chance of a spill? Its not about saving money on Gas! Its about stopping the rise of the cost of oil which is driving down the value of the dollar.

Once the speculators start to see the United States taking action to combat their constant driving the price of oil higher they will get bearish in the market and the cost of Oil will go down and the value of the dollar will rise, pushing us out of the current crisis.
If you are not aware of the implications of the current situation, you should not comment.


P.S. Jack its not sketchy, it was something that should have been done a couple of months ago.
Its just Bush in his usual lameness of not acting quickly enough. He is a fool.

[Rayne]

Originally Posted by drift freaq

.... Its not about saving money on Gas! Its about stopping the rise of the cost of oil which is driving down the value of the dollar.....

The price of oil devalues the US Dollar? You really need to look into the effects of interest of a nine, plus, trillion dollar deficit in addition to the lack of confidence other countries have for the monetary system in the US.

The fact that a private, non-government, corporation called the Federal Reserve gained the right to control the monetary system in the US, back in 1913, set the US dollar into a downward tail spin. When the monetary system of a country is no longer backed by actual substance the value of it currency begins to fall.

Here in the US, our currency "Federal Reserve Notes" have not been back up with anything since 1913 with the signing of the "Federal Reserve Act." Which by the way was written and authored by international bankers on Jekyll island. Furthermore the act was voted on and passed using only seven members of Congress over a federal holiday.

Anyway...the value of the US currency is influenced by other things, than oil.

[downshift_sideways]

Originally Posted by Rayne

The price of oil devalues the US Dollar? You really need to look into the effects of interest of a nine, plus, trillion dollar deficit in addition to the lack of confidence other countries have for the monetary system in the US.

The fact that a private, non-government, corporation called the Federal Reserve gained the right to control the monetary system in the US, back in 1933, set the US dollar into a downward tail spin. When the monetary system of a country is no longer backed by actual substance the value of it currency begins to fall.

Here in the US, our currency "Federal Reserve Notes" have not been back up with anything since 1933 with the signing of the "Federal Reserve Act." Which by the way was written and authored by international bankers on Jekyll island. Furthermore the act was voted on and passed using only seven members of Congress over a federal holiday.

Anyway...the value of the US currency is influenced by other things, than oil.

Actually...

Our economy has always been downhill...

This matter of oil however is the main setback in the economy as we speak.
Yes there are other deficits, but if you open your eyes. Our supply is being cut day by day. We need to "explore" and be self sufficient.

were hurting bad now...Even if we print more dollars, that sets us back EVEN MORE in debt, and the dollar loses it's value even more.

I agree with driftfreaq

".... Its not about saving money on Gas! Its about stopping the rise of the cost of oil which is driving down the value of the dollar....."

That's dead center.

[drift freaq]

Originally Posted by Rayne

The price of oil devalues the US Dollar? You really need to look into the effects of interest of a nine, plus, trillion dollar deficit in addition to the lack of confidence other countries have for the monetary system in the US.

The fact that a private, non-government, corporation called the Federal Reserve gained the right to control the monetary system in the US, back in 1933, set the US dollar into a downward tail spin. When the monetary system of a country is no longer backed by actual substance the value of it currency begins to fall.

Here in the US, our currency "Federal Reserve Notes" have not been back up with anything since 1933 with the signing of the "Federal Reserve Act." Which by the way was written and authored by international bankers on Jekyll island. Furthermore the act was voted on and passed using only seven members of Congress over a federal holiday.

Anyway...the value of the US currency is influenced by other things, than oil.

Ah sounds like you qouted a textbook. Do you invest? Do you follow World markets? The commodities market? On a daily basis? I do. In the current situation everytime the cost of of barrel of oil rises we see a drop in the value of the dollar.
Why? Because as oil goes up and the dollar drops the investors lose confidence in buying dollars and they buy oil. Its being widely talked about in the financial world right now because its happening. Driving down the price of Oil would stabilize the dollar and make it increase.

If you don't study the current situation you have no idea whats happening. This is a whole new and unprecedented situation. Oil is not going up based on the supply and demand model. Its going up on Speculation.
As it goes up it becomes more costly for Americans and spending goes down,productivity drops because of the higher costs, that weakens the value of the dollar. Oil is not the only factor. The sub prime mess is a factor as well but its a large enough factor that bringing down the cost of Oil would stabilize the dollar, once stabilized world investors would buy dollars and it would rise.
This is a economic fact on the world level. If you want to believe all the conspiracy theory shit about the federal reserve go right ahead.

Our National debt is also because of our dependence on imported oil. Again ,if had drilled already, we would not have as large of a dependency on imported oil, thereby lowering our National debt. Which again would strengthen the dollar.

[Omarius Maximus]

Originally Posted by drift freaq

Ah sounds like you qouted a textbook. Do you invest? Do you follow World markets? The commodities market? On a daily basis? I do. In the current situation everytime the cost of of barrel of oil rises we see a drop in the value of the dollar.
Why? Because as oil goes up and the dollar drops the investors lose confidence in buying dollars and they buy oil. Its being widely talked about in the financial world right now because its happening. Driving down the price of Oil would stabilize the dollar and make it increase.

If you don't study the current situation you have no idea whats happening. This is a whole new and unprecedented situation. Oil is not going up based on the supply and demand model. Its going up on Speculation.
As it goes up it becomes more costly for Americans and spending goes down,productivity drops because of the higher costs, that weakens the value of the dollar. Oil is not the only factor. The sub prime mess is a factor as well but its a large enough factor that bringing down the cost of Oil would stabilize the dollar, once stabilized world investors would buy dollars and it would rise.
This is a economic fact on the world level. If you want to believe all the conspiracy theory shit about the federal reserve go right ahead.

Our National debt is also because of our dependence on imported oil. Again ,if had drilled already, we would not have as large of a dependency on imported oil, thereby lowering our National debt. Which again would strengthen the dollar.

I think you have things a bit confused. Oil is traded via U.S. dollars (mainly because the U.S. dollar has had a history of being the most stable currency in the world). It's not oil prices that go up, then the value of the dollar that goes down. It's the value of the dollar going down, THEN oil prices going up to compensate for the true cost.

If the fed keeps printing money like crazy for bailouts due to irresponsible management/shitty financial markets, oil will be pegged onto a more stable currency...probably the euro. Then our economy will take an even bigger shit...and so will your argument.

If you knew anything about our current economic climate, you'd understand that oil is the least of our worries.

[hitman]

uhg, youre an idiot. its "youre" going to..., not your going to
not only do i not think this will help (its estimated this will at best deduce 25 cents a gallon), but, furthermore the value of the dollar is less significant to me than nature. america sucks ass and it deserves a weak dollar.

[drift freaq]

Originally Posted by hitman

uhg, youre an idiot. its "youre" going to..., not your going to
not only do i not think this will help (its estimated this will at best deduce 25 cents a gallon), but, furthermore the value of the dollar is less significant to me than nature. america sucks ass and it deserves a weak dollar.

With that kind of talk, why don't you just leave. Oh you caught me on a typo, because you don't have a valid argument, you fail. Your response is typical of losers who can't put up a legit argument for their position.

[BustedS13]

Originally Posted by drift freaq

With that kind of talk, why don't you just leave. Oh you caught me on a typo, because you don't have a valid argument, you fail. Your response is typical of losers who can't put up a legit argument for their position.

shotgun goes booyah


seriously, let's get drillin'.

[hitman]

Originally Posted by drift freaq

With that kind of talk, why don't you just leave. Oh you caught me on a typo, because you don't have a valid argument, you fail. Your response is typical of losers who can't put up a legit argument for their position.

btw, before trying to use "big" and "impressive" words like "valid" maybe you should know what they mean? validity does not mean the argument is true. it merely refers to the logical structure of a deductive argument.
the correct word you were looking for, is either "sound" 9deductive) or "strong" (inductive)
maybe you should learn about arguments before you try to make them.

[BustedS13]

Originally Posted by hitman

btw, before trying to use "big" and "impressive" words like "valid" maybe you should know what they mean? validity does not mean the argument is true. it merely refers to the logical structure of a deductive argument.
the correct word you were looking for, is either "sound" 9deductive) or "strong" (inductive)
maybe you should learn about arguments before you try to make them.

i think he was just telling you to stop being a *slur deleted*
you obviously didn't catch that, though.

[ESmorz]

Originally Posted by BustedS13

i think he was just telling you to stop being a *slur deleted*
you obviously didn't catch that, though.

BOOSH!

Drill everywhere, kill everything. I just want some cheaper fucking gas.

[ronmcdon]

Better late than never. To Bush's credit, I see no reason why doing something at this time would benefit him much, if at all.

That aside, I do hope there are plans to build additional refineries and/or expand additional ones. It's one thing to increase crude oil supply, it's quite another to have savings to consumers like me and you.

[TheWolf]

I'd prefer if my floridian beaches stayed nice instead of looking like texas beaches...

[dert420sx]

Originally Posted by TheWolf

I'd prefer if my floridian beaches stayed nice instead of looking like texas beaches...

here here! same goes for the california beaches as well! i wouldn't wanna go surfing in an oil spill and shower off with some dawn.

[drift freaq]

Originally Posted by dert420sx

here here! same goes for the california beaches as well! i wouldn't wanna go surfing in an oil spill and shower off with some dawn.

Drilling off California is in the Santa Barbara region. Fact is there is so much oil seeping out the ground there naturally that if you go surfing or swimming there you get tar on your feet already. Drilling will actually clean it up not make it worse. Also you live in Long Beach. Which means for the most part short of San Diego county, the beaches from Santa Barbara down to Orange county are already shit holes and the waters are polluted. If you want your beaches cleaner you need to lobby LA county to clean up their sewage before the water goes to sea.

People need to realize something, drilling for oil off the coast of our country is not as environmentally terrible as the radical environmentalists would have you believe. Fact is drilling platforms do not spill much if ever. There is like one time where it happened. I am for environmentalism but with prudence. If this drilling had been allowed ten years ago, we would not have the current oil price speculation problem, we have today.

Of course, most of this will be lost on most of you, because you may not be financially aware, because your either to young, or still in College.
This is not meant to be condescending towards you either, its just a fact. You look at things differently when you are earning your living in life and investing in the well being of the country.

Oh and like I said to hitman if you do not care about this country and the dollar then you should just pack up and move someplace else.

Its were you live and will most likely live unless you plan on leaving . To which I say there is the door don't let it hit you on your ass on the way out.

[Mi Beardo es Loco]

Originally Posted by drift freaq

Drilling off California is in the Santa Barbara region. Fact is there is so much oil seeping out the ground there naturally that if you go surfing or swimming there you get tar on your feet already. Drilling will actually clean it up not make it worse. Also you live in Long Beach. Which means for the most part short of San Diego county, the beaches from Santa Barbara down to Orange county are already shit holes and the waters are polluted. If you want your beaches cleaner you need to lobby LA county to clean up their sewage before the water goes to sea.

People need to realize something, drilling for oil off the coast of our country is not as environmentally terrible as the radical environmentalists would have you believe. Fact is drilling platforms do not spill much if ever. There is like one time where it happened. I am for environmentalism but with prudence. If this drilling had been allowed ten years ago, we would not have the current oil price speculation problem, we have today.

Of course, most of this will be lost on most of you, because you may not be financially aware, because your either to young, or still in College.
This is not meant to be condescending towards you either, its just a fact. You look at things differently when you are earning your living in life and investing in the well being of the country.

Oh and like I said to hitman if you do not care about this country and the dollar then you should just pack up and move someplace else.

Its were you live and will most likely live unless you plan on leaving . To which I say there is the door don't let it hit you on your ass on the way out.

right on the FUCKING button! +rep for you buddy. This is exactly right and is the EXACT reason why a ban on offshore drilling baffled a LOT of people. People who don't know just assume that drilling for oil is a atomic bomb waiting to happen, which is DEF not the case.

[hitman]

Originally Posted by drift freaq

Drilling off California is in the Santa Barbara region. Fact is there is so much oil seeping out the ground there naturally that if you go surfing or swimming there you get tar on your feet already. Drilling will actually clean it up not make it worse. Also you live in Long Beach. Which means for the most part short of San Diego county, the beaches from Santa Barbara down to Orange county are already shit holes and the waters are polluted. If you want your beaches cleaner you need to lobby LA county to clean up their sewage before the water goes to sea.

People need to realize something, drilling for oil off the coast of our country is not as environmentally terrible as the radical environmentalists would have you believe. Fact is drilling platforms do not spill much if ever. There is like one time where it happened. I am for environmentalism but with prudence. If this drilling had been allowed ten years ago, we would not have the current oil price speculation problem, we have today.

Of course, most of this will be lost on most of you, because you may not be financially aware, because your either to young, or still in College.
This is not meant to be condescending towards you either, its just a fact. You look at things differently when you are earning your living in life and investing in the well being of the country.

Oh and like I said to hitman if you do not care about this country and the dollar then you should just pack up and move someplace else.

Its were you live and will most likely live unless you plan on leaving . To which I say there is the door don't let it hit you on your ass on the way out.

i would if i could. i plan on moving when i move into a phd program next fall.
also, i hate retards like you that view everything as merely standing reserve. unfortunately i cant move away from people like you. maybe you should read some you fucktard instead of just listening to fox news or the morning paper, or a book by mccain or obama

[drift freaq]

Originally Posted by hitman

i would if i could. i plan on moving when i move into a phd program next fall.
also, i hate retards like you that view everything as merely standing reserve. unfortunately i cant move away from people like you. maybe you should read some you fucktard instead of just listening to fox news or the morning paper, or a book by mccain or obama

Wow, once again a person who loses the argument because they don't use facts result to insults and swear words. You're really looking educated and bright here, NOT!. I don't watch or listen to Fox News you little insolent child. I wish they would deport people like you because you're not worthy of citizenship. I know more about World Politics and the Financial world than you could ever hope to know. You have been owned here and your acting you a spoiled insolent child.

On and by the way your comment about big words. Wow, are you really are that ignorant as to think the ordinary English I use are big words. Validity is not a big word and can be used in the context of if your argument is valid. Try and nit pick it trying to sound all educated, fact is It can be used in my statement about you and was used. Get over it.
Oh and nice to see that neg rep where you call me a fucktard. Wow, real mature!

[dert420sx]

Originally Posted by drift freaq

Drilling off California is in the Santa Barbara region. Fact is there is so much oil seeping out the ground there naturally that if you go surfing or swimming there you get tar on your feet already. Drilling will actually clean it up not make it worse. Also you live in Long Beach. Which means for the most part short of San Diego county, the beaches from Santa Barbara down to Orange county are already shit holes and the waters are polluted. If you want your beaches cleaner you need to lobby LA county to clean up their sewage before the water goes to sea.

People need to realize something, drilling for oil off the coast of our country is not as environmentally terrible as the radical environmentalists would have you believe. Fact is drilling platforms do not spill much if ever. There is like one time where it happened. I am for environmentalism but with prudence. If this drilling had been allowed ten years ago, we would not have the current oil price speculation problem, we have today.

Of course, most of this will be lost on most of you, because you may not be financially aware, because your either to young, or still in College.
This is not meant to be condescending towards you either, its just a fact. You look at things differently when you are earning your living in life and investing in the well being of the country.

Oh and like I said to hitman if you do not care about this country and the dollar then you should just pack up and move someplace else.

Its were you live and will most likely live unless you plan on leaving . To which I say there is the door don't let it hit you on your ass on the way out.

it's true that the waters off long beach are shit- all the damn commercial ships ruined it. i would not set foot in the waters off long beach to orange county, myself. i've also been a long time supporter of the surfrider foundation and we do voice our concerns. in fact, we temporarily got a halt on the 241 hwy extension all the way to the 5 fwy.

people gotta realize that for anything you build to "ease" traffic congestion, it will be years before any improvements are seen, if any at all. (remember a time before the 91 freeway? how much did that help traffic??) the 241 toll road is planned to cut across some federally protected wetlands. for what? just so a bunch of arrogant rich fucks can get their own route from the mountains to the 5 fwy? that'll ruin all that pristine land and the ecosystems that inhabit it. not to mention that trestles surf spot will no longer have its natural wetlands as a backdrop when the fwy is built there.

anyway, im done thread jacking but this is all along the lines of the oil drilling in the ocean. the ocean is a vast resource that shouldn't be treated like a dump. man is the earth's biggest and most numerous parasite.

[BustedS13]

Originally Posted by TheWolf

I'd prefer if my floridian beaches stayed nice instead of looking like texas beaches...

you know, you make a point. was there a spill or something along the texas coast? i went to corpus christi one time and the beaches SUCKED. i was used to white destin sand, though.

[murda-c]

needs more alternative fuels.

though i don't know what bush could do about that and still make money.

[02BRB20]

if they only drilled in the Dakotas and Montana then this bill might fly....maybe....eh probably not, the Florida Gulf is already polluted enough, red tide is no fun.

Drilling in America is pointless though, its not that oil companies dont have any new areas to drill, its just that they understand their non renewable resource drives the world's economy. There are huge oil reserves in Africa, Saudia Arabia, and S. America but they dont drill them because of a. political reasons and b. why go through the hassle to refine and produce more oil when you can sell 1 barrel for $200 instead of 2 for $100 each. There are no checks and balances in the pure capitalist game people love to play, greed is a sin baby.

[aznpoopy]

i'm all for whatever helps

but, i doubt any new finds will dramatically change the oil situation. fact of the matter is offshore oil is harder to get to and more expensive to pull out, and US had its peak in the 70s as predicted. any new exploitable finds are welcome, but overall i'd be surprised if they were more than a mere hump in the declining half of a graph of domestic oil production

[Baka Sama]

Just so you know off shore drilling will not effect the price of oil for atleast 5-10 years. At which time most cars will depend on oil a lot less. Seems like a plan to make more money for oil compaines once our dependence on oil for cars has gone away. wow. I cant believe people think this is actually gonna help anything. We need more funding on other fuel for our cars before china has as many cars on the road as we do.

[flip3d]

We're not getting cheaper gas. End.

[rps13drift]

Im sorry! but if we dont do it china/cuba will! We need to get our econemy back!

AMERICA!!! FUCK YEAH!!!!