Weight obsession - part weights on S13

[Def]

I don't think there are diminishing returns at all, in fact, the returns INCREASE as you keep shedding weight. 30 lbs off a 3500 lb car? Not a big change, only 0.85% less weight. You would probably be hard pressed to really feel that. Now 30 lbs off a 2500 lb car, that's 1.2% less weight. 2000 lb car? 1.5% less weight. So it starts to become more and more apparent for each pound you lose as your car gets lighter.


I'd rather spend money on track time and tires at this point than buy other stuff, so I'm going to see how far I can really go with the stock panels while not making the car significantly less safe in any one type of impact.


Looks like lexan rear hatch window, remove as much weight as possible to the doors while keeping some crash protection, and then attack the rear bumper support.

[Corbic]

Originally Posted by fckillerbee

100 lbs is 9 horsepower...i'm sure all of us have heard this....and it all adds up.

so instead of removing shit....add power! haha.

Originally Posted by Def

I'd rather spend money on track time and tires at this point than buy other stuff, so I'm going to see how far I can really go with the stock panels while not making the car significantly less safe in any one type of impact.


Looks like lexan rear hatch window, remove as much weight as possible to the doors while keeping some crash protection, and then attack the rear bumper support.

But you are agreeing with him.

What will make a bigger difference, saving 170lbs by getting a FRP Hood, Fenders, Hatch, doors and gutting the interior.. For ~$2000....

Or upgrading your turbo/powertrain and go from 200whp to 400whp, or maybe just 300whp and some bigger brakes?

What will do better a stripped car, or a car with cage and bracing (adding weight) but all else equal.

Also, the diminished returns are lik FRP fender, cost? Over $300, easier to damage, and you shed maybe 5-10lbs. ~1hp gain.

If I said I just spend $300 on an airfilter to gain 1hp everyone would laugh.

[racepar1]

Let's stop this "more power vs less weight" crap. Reducing weight makes the car accelerate, stop and handle better. It improves the car in every possible way. More power only makes the car accelerate better and it can make the car HARDER to stop and turn. Reducing weight also takes strain off the entire drivetrain and chasis, which increases reliability. More power does exactly the opposite. Besides all that a more powerful engine usually comes with a shorter lifespan and less reliability again. Horsepower is great and all, but reducing weight serves a completely different purpose. The two cannot be compared as their performance benefits are only similar in one aspect.

[josephin510]

Originally Posted by racepar1

Let's stop this "more power vs less weight" crap. Reducing weight makes the car accelerate, stop and handle better. It improves the car in every possible way. More power only makes the car accelerate better and it can make the car HARDER to stop and turn. Reducing weight also takes strain off the entire drivetrain and chasis, which increases reliability. More power does exactly the opposite. Besides all that a more powerful engine usually comes with a shorter lifespan and less reliability again. Horsepower is great and all, but reducing weight serves a completely different purpose. The two cannot be compared as their performance benefits are only similar in one aspect.

Just as I was getting confused you posted this.

[GripTerror]

Originally Posted by racepar1

Let's stop this "more power vs less weight" crap. Reducing weight makes the car accelerate, stop and handle better. It improves the car in every possible way. More power only makes the car accelerate better and it can make the car HARDER to stop and turn. Reducing weight also takes strain off the entire drivetrain and chasis, which increases reliability. More power does exactly the opposite. Besides all that a more powerful engine usually comes with a shorter lifespan and less reliability again. Horsepower is great and all, but reducing weight serves a completely different purpose. The two cannot be compared as their performance benefits are only similar in one aspect.

This

Fuck racepar1... you and I share the same mind... from reading many of your posts over and over again haha...

Kognition also has a point but I must concur racepar1's points hold truer. I mean... alhtough it is not too hard to add power, the benefit of less weight although sometimes painstakingly ass paining are beneficial in a multitude of ways That is if you are serious of cutting every tenth of a second on lap times...

Oh and for people saying panels are only 1lbs or whatever... well... I went pretty hardcore on my car's diet and I easily took off 300lbs and that's on a car that had no AC... it's doable...

Remember he also has a cage, so that's added weight back.

I even went as far as cutting unecessary wires from the wiring loom (speaker lines, etc...) and only left what's necessary. Got rid of all the under dash crap (heating, cooling, etc...), so yeah... if you want a hardcore track car go the mile... my opinion... and add downforce and im sure kognition can help lol.

Trust me.. the more weight I lose the more pronounced it feels on the car over time.. it just does.. and it makes the car that much more fun to me.

[Corbic]

Originally Posted by GripTerror

This
Trust me.. the more weight I lose the more pronounced it feels on the car over time.. it just does.. and it makes the car that much more fun to me.

Feelings are for girls, facts are for men.

Is it "that much faster" or just "that much noisier"?

[SoSideways]

Originally Posted by Corbic

Feelings are for girls, facts are for men.

Oh no you didn't.

Watch out man, he works out, and makes fun of people who have powersteering because he can turn his 330mm steering wheel with just 2 fingers.

[Corbic]

Originally Posted by SoSideways

Oh no you didn't.

Watch out man, he works out, and makes fun of people who have powersteering because he can turn his 330mm steering wheel with just 2 fingers.

I hear he has a terrifying grip.

[GripTerror]

Originally Posted by Corbic

Feelings are for girls, facts are for men.

Is it "that much faster" or just "that much noisier"?

Real men don't complain about noise, they make noise.

Originally Posted by Corbic

I hear he has a terrifying grip.

You heard right

Originally Posted by SoSideways

Oh no you didn't.

Watch out man, he works out, and makes fun of people who have powersteering because he can turn his 330mm steering wheel with just 2 fingers.

^The nerd has spoken

I like raw cars, stop hating, as russel peters china accent said "be a man" lol

[Def]

Originally Posted by Corbic

But you are agreeing with him.

What will make a bigger difference, saving 170lbs by getting a FRP Hood, Fenders, Hatch, doors and gutting the interior.. For ~$2000....

Or upgrading your turbo/powertrain and go from 200whp to 400whp, or maybe just 300whp and some bigger brakes?

What will do better a stripped car, or a car with cage and bracing (adding weight) but all else equal.

Also, the diminished returns are lik FRP fender, cost? Over $300, easier to damage, and you shed maybe 5-10lbs. ~1hp gain.

If I said I just spend $300 on an airfilter to gain 1hp everyone would laugh.

I'm probably in the low 300's on track at low boost(14ish psi on a GT2871R, cams, intake mani, ported stuff etc.). I could turn the boost up, but I have my doubts as to how long the stock engine will last, so I'm keeping it reasonable for now.

More power is a turn of the knob away, but it's not really needed since the street tires hold the car back more than power at this point.

Like I said again, I'm not interested in spending $$$$$ on some FRP panel to save 10 lbs at this point. There are other areas where I could save weight for very little $$$, so that's why I asked about the items I did.


I have racepar1's ideas on weight reduction, when you on the track, every pound off the car just makes everything easier on the car. You accelerate harder with the same power, brake faster for the same traction, corner harder - it just makes the car easier to get around the track, and it becomes even more pronounced when you add downforce(which I already have, check the earlier track pic).