Test Mule. Solid Sub frame Risers off ebay and they are legit.

[GabeS14]

Originally Posted by Corbic

I'm so anal, I u


I've used plenty of eBay parts in the past and been disappointed every time. Do it right the first time and only do it once.

no one cares how anal you are. No one cares about your gay anal aids talk.
This is a small block Of aluminum. Shut the hell up with that shit. The op found a hell Of a deal. Lets all thank him! And move On




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[MADE]

Now I'm waiting for someone to lie and say they brought this item and it failed at hwy speeds. Where is a mod when you need one.

[s14j]

wow.
all this over blocks of aluminum?
is this really needed?
man u guys take it over-bored. way to much.

[ManoNegra]

Originally Posted by s14j

wow.
all this over blocks of aluminum?
is this really needed?
man u guys take it over-bored. way to much.

I think of it more as an allegory or metaphor that illustrates that way people
feel about legit vs reverse engineering parts/stolen ideas

someone recognized a need, saw a problem, listened to feedback... whatever
they thought about the problem
weighed the pros and cons on designing and making a part
decided to take a risk
got their hands on a few s-chassis subframes
came up with a design
tested the fit
made adjustments
installed it on cars
got feedbacks
made changes/improvements to the original design

vs

someone bought an original product
handed to people that can use calipers, micrometers or maybe have a CMM
transferred that data to an NC lathe
made a batch of a few hundred
sold them on ebay
made profit with very little risk

people fall into two camps:
those that appreciate a company that took a risk and developed a much needed product
and support them because said company will most likely re-invest their earnings into making other cool products

or those that want to spend the least amount of money to fit an image or be part of a scene

ps.
making subframe bushings press fit ala SPL requires much more manufacturing precision than making subframe risers that slip fit and need epoxy to stay put.
and anodizing is really not a bid deal. It's typically a lot charge, it usually comes down to pennies per part.
oh, and lastly, 6061 is probably the cheapest of metals to buy since it's so widely used

[godrifttoday]

Ah someone that know about reverse engineering ! I'm going to copy ur Kat oil adapter and sell it for 60 bucks!! By the way u still have them for sale?

[s14j]

i understand that.
and well put Manonegra!

its just funny that people get so crazy over this haha

i just dont see how ther so horrible,
not saying that im buy them cuz ther cheeper
shit i wouldn't buy the pbm ones to many vibrations, i rather just buy nismo ones

[murda-c]

Originally Posted by ManoNegra

people fall into two camps:
those that appreciate a company that took a risk and developed a much needed product
and support them because said company will most likely re-invest their earnings into making other cool products

or those that want to spend the least amount of money to fit an image or be part of a scene

subframe risers=fitting an image?

thats a bit of a stretch...

[Corbic]

Originally Posted by murda-c

subframe risers=fitting an image?

thats a bit of a stretch...

He is talking about knock off parts in general.

[R33E8]

Originally Posted by Corbic

I'm so anal, I use a @#%king Craftsman Torque wrench and not some garbage Autozone one. In fact, my whole "hate walmart/Chinese substandard products" comes from 7 years ago when I was wrenching on my VW, with a Walmart bargain ratchet set (hey, only a moron buys a $500 SnapOn set, you can get one for $15 at Walmart)... my 3/8's Ratchet busted at the handle and I got stitches. Fuck that pig iron shit.


I've used plenty of eBay parts in the past and been disappointed every time. Do it right the first time and only do it once.

Lol sorry for nit picking but if you were so anal you probably would have done some research about buying your craftsman torque wrench... I think it's called being smart with your money instead of being anal.. I did my research and bought a precision instruments torque wrench and get it calibrated once a year. I read reviews and make informed decisions before purchasing parts. If I find something that is equal or better in quality and does what I want for less, I'm going to buy it..

Anyways to the OP, thanks for confirming that they are identical to the PDM subframe risers.. I'm sure this info will help some budget minded builders..

[ManoNegra]

Originally Posted by s14j

i understand that.
and well put Manonegra!

its just funny that people get so crazy over this haha

i just dont see how ther so horrible,
not saying that im buy them cuz ther cheeper
shit i wouldn't buy the pbm ones to many vibrations, i rather just buy nismo ones

that goddamn thing required about 5 machining operations
a couple of which involved 'creative' fixturing
not to mention the joy of making the fittings in house
I still believe we ask way too little for them

and yes, we still have a few left over

Originally Posted by Corbic

He is talking about knock off parts in general.

ditto

[holemilk00]

Originally Posted by ManoNegra

that goddamn thing required about 5 machining operations
a couple of which involved 'creative' fixturing
not to mention the joy of making the fittings in house
I still believe we ask way too little for them

and yes, we still have a few left over

Its a great piece man, I have two.

[Corbic]

Originally Posted by R33E8

Lol sorry for nit picking but if you were so anal you probably would have done some research about buying your craftsman torque wrench... I think it's called being smart with your money instead of being anal.. I did my research and bought a precision instruments torque wrench and get it calibrated once a year. I read reviews and make informed decisions before purchasing parts. If I find something that is equal or better in quality and does what I want for less, I'm going to buy it..

Anyways to the OP, thanks for confirming that they are identical to the PDM subframe risers.. I'm sure this info will help some budget minded builders..

Be a wise shopper then. I paid maybe $20 more for the CM over the Chinnese-Garbage. CM Member, Sears Discount, Coupon et al.

One tool set a bought two years ago on black-Friday with all my discounts came out to be $180, normally $500.

[cemtoes]

You guys nitpick so much...it's subframe risers....fucking subframe risers. The originals are godamn rubber and you're worried about aluminum ones not being strong enough and failing. Who cares if he's not "supporting" pbm, does that mean anyone who isn't buying pbm parts is a douchebag or something?

This is all coming from a guy who owns tons of pbm stuff and reps them hard because they have good quality products for decent prices but damnit, if i was tight on cash those alum ebay risers would work perfectly fine.

[Freddy]

What funny about all this is you guys act, like big companies don't copy from one another.

I had a co-op/internship at combat sports, were they make composite softball and baseball bats. I worked in R&D, let me tell you that everyone in industry reverse engineers their competitor product. I'm talking companies like Easton rebook.

If a company wants to protect their product, patent your shit. If you don't, don't come complaining went your sales are low. Cause someone reverse engineered their product.

[GabeS14]

I would compare these to solid transmition mounts. Some company's sell them for over $200 bucks. When in all truth you can have them fabbbed up for under $20. And any fab guy knows this.
My point is. Great job for PBM creating a new item that we need. But if it was possible to offer the product for much less. And we all know it was. Why put a higher price tag on it???
Maaaaayybe charging a higher price for let's say the first 100 pieces. Just to justify the expense to create and design the part. And then lower the price to a reasonable cost... Now that would make sense.

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[urmyhero4now]

Originally Posted by Freddy

If a company wants to protect their product, patent your shit. If you don't, don't come complaining went your sales are low. Cause someone reverse engineered their product.

Truth.

[ryan hagen]

Any high school student in machine shop coupld make these if i gave him about 5 measurements.............. so when something is so easy to make i cant see making such a big deal about a "rip off part" I cant even see much for R&D going into a part such as this. Spl would be considered a fancy copy then

and after Mike Pollard's PBM part failure it was enough to make me continue to make my own parts. Then i dont feel bad if anything breaks.

i notice at least in the midwest alot of the baller we buy every thing name brand cars never hit the track, they go through 3 year builds then get parted out, but i d say average here, the cars that show up to the track and run, have knock off parts, I d rather have track time and do 12 events a year, than worrie about paing 20% more on part so some company in socal that has cult following can sponsor a formula drift car. Most the arms in a s13 suspension can be easily made from a dirt track catalog. I'D take a afco/qa1 link over a china link any day. I make $11.50 a hour SO $40 with taxes involved is like 6 hours of work, or 40% of my entry fee for a track day.

[hOngsterr]

Originally Posted by Corbic

I'm so anal, I use a @#%king Craftsman Torque wrench and not some garbage Autozone one. In fact, my whole "hate walmart/Chinese substandard products" comes from 7 years ago when I was wrenching on my VW, with a Walmart bargain ratchet set (hey, only a moron buys a $500 SnapOn set, you can get one for $15 at Walmart)... my 3/8's Ratchet busted at the handle and I got stitches. Fuck that pig iron shit.


I've used plenty of eBay parts in the past and been disappointed every time. Do it right the first time and only do it once.

ehhh... not picking at anything, but sometimes cheap shit do really hold up, maybe not walmarts, but Harbor Freights TQ wrench does.

MY350Z.COM Forums - View Single Post - Torque wrench?

[jspecusa]

Here's my take on this.
It's a thick piece of metal it will not break apart however
what you are paying is for the ability to bitch and complain if there are problems.

For example, the 2 parts "look" the same, but what if when you install the ebay knock off
and every time you shift there's a noise?

All that money and time spent putting it in and it's becomes nothing more then
an annoying problem.

When you have a company behind a product, they actually do RnD and revision to the product to insure the quality and fitment, therefor you can actually call them and tell them what's wrong with the product vs ebay you are SOL.

Yes, my craftsman and snapon tools "look" the same to me, but when you have been stripping old rusty jdm front clips over 10 years you'll will not appreciate the play the lesser quality tools have over the nice precision fitment tools.

Nothing is worst then a stripped nut or bolt, it creates problem and waste of time.
That's why for all the 8,10,12,14,17mm I have Snapon, it's expensive but at the end
it save me time and money which pays for the difference in pricing.

Last I want to educate people new to this industry, it's a very bad industry for profit especially for retailers.

The average shop makes a profit margin of 15 to 20% which is very low if you know anything about business, and ebay takes about 9% for fees which means the only items
that can survive are no name brand make in china knock off parts due to the low cost.

Experienced ebayer can tell you that name brand stuff is actually higher in price on ebay due to ebay seller increase profit margin to pay for the ebay fees.

In this economy, most retail store don't perform labor will go under, and the bigger they are the faster they fall.

Most company will move toward internet base only vs retail store to cut down cost of operation so they can be competitive in pricing, what that means to you is you'll lose the convenient of same day shopping and advice/help, you'll have to turn to internet for research and help on products.

Just my 5cent,

Sam

[BoostSlideWayz]

everyone seems to be jumping on him for ordering the cheaper ones but he lost at a straw game thats why he had to order em. some people dont believe in like.. *knock offs* ebay has companies that have just as good quality as legitimate companies. every one is all for the expensive stuff and the stuff thats crazy expensive but really your paying for the name.. i have shit on my car from ebay and i couldn't be happier. my friend paid big bucks for a rad from mishmoto and i got mine from cx racing. mine was so much cheaper than his and his is just polished. other than that theres nothing better about his over mine besides the name he paid for.

[CrimsonRockett]

Originally Posted by BoostSlideWayz

everyone seems to be jumping on him for ordering the cheaper ones but he lost at a straw game thats why he had to order em. some people dont believe in like.. *knock offs* ebay has companies that have just as good quality as legitimate companies. every one is all for the expensive stuff and the stuff thats crazy expensive but really your paying for the name.. i have shit on my car from ebay and i couldn't be happier. my friend paid big bucks for a rad from mishmoto and i got mine from cx racing. mine was so much cheaper than his and his is just polished. other than that theres nothing better about his over mine besides the name he paid for.

Hah, "big bucks" for a Mishimoto radiator? They're the same as ebay radiators. All they do is paint their logo on it and add a fancy sticker to the cap. Try Griffin radiators.

The whole point of this is that there's a difference between a company who spends time R&D'ing a product as compared to someone who just picks that product up, measures it, and copies it with cheaper quality materials.

As mentioned above, if you have trouble with...let's just say SPL subframe bushings. You give them a call, let them know you're having issues, and they'll do the best they can to help.

Now, if a problem arises with the ebay part, you're shit out of luck. Same goes for just about any other "ebay" brand.

ManoNegra for example R&D'd KA oil block adapters. I'm sure he'd be pissed if someone bought one from him, copied it, and sold it for less. About 90% of the time, you pay more for a reason.

We're not telling you to stop ordering eBay parts. Just saying think about it before making your purchase. If it's only a couple more bucks to order a part from a company that stands behind their product (also giving you piece of mind), it's worth it. If you still feel like spending money on a product that MIGHT be junk, fully knowing that if that shit doesn't work out for you, you won't see a cent of that money back, go for it.

We've had this discussion before (several times at that). No use in letting this stay open.