SR20DET: Rod Knock or Timing Chain Guide noise?

[Dee]

Ok so my completely stock sr20det started make a noise which to me sounds like a failing rod bearing just not as violent and it's strange to me because I change and check the oil religiously and I occasionally sprint drive it through the local pass up here but that's it.

Now down to the conditions. The noise occurs around 2,500-3,500 rpm on light or hard throttle and it disappears until around 6,000 rpm then you can faintly hear it again. I am unable to get a video at the moment but after looking at some videos on youtube this guy has the exact problem as me down to the same rpm range the noise occurs.


Tomorrow after work im gonna pull the valve cover and have a look around...but Rod knock or guides?

Just want some friendly opinions is all.

Thanks Zilvians
-Dee

[KaminaSan]

If that's what you are hearing, its most likely knock...

Pull the oil pan. You will know.

[StryfeS13]

Well, I had a KA once that would do that exact same thing. I sold it to a friend, and I guess the main bearings were on their way out.

I'm not sure about SR's though, it's a completely different motor. Check the lifters/bleed them all. If it still makes the sound, pull the oil pan and try to shake your rods...if they move around, then that's your issue.

[Dee]

yep definitely rod knock, got worse today on my way home from work.....fucking hell. Think I'm gonna go KA-T.

[Corbic]

Originally Posted by Dee

yep definitely rod knock, got worse today on my way home from work.....fucking hell. Think I'm gonna go KA-T.

Yeah, cause Bearings are hella expensive.

Rebuild that shit -

Bearings - $100
Gasket Set - $140
Machine Shop -$40
ARP Head Studs - $140
Piston Rings - $100

Brand New Motor instead of haggard KA-T - Priceless

[Dee]

Originally Posted by Corbic

Yeah, cause Bearings are hella expensive.

Rebuild that shit -

Bearings - $100
Gasket Set - $140
Machine Shop -$40
ARP Head Studs - $140
Piston Rings - $100

Brand New Motor instead of haggard KA-T - Priceless

Yes, I am aware of how much the parts cost, thanks though. I've been wanting to go back to KA anyway. I'll keep the SR and rebuild it for another project later down the road but as for my Daily driver I'm going back to KA, I'm sick of Cali and the CHP.

Oh and you forgot one crucial part of that list. LABOR because I haven't got a clue on how to rebuild a motor. I can do head gasket, turbo installations, etc but when it comes to the bottom end I know jack.

[abunai the drifter]

sound like a timing chain has some slak in it if i was rod knock you would hear it all the time trust me had sr with rod knok and it would get louder as rpm gose up

[Dee]

Originally Posted by abunai the drifter

sound like a timing chain has some slak in it if i was rod knock you would hear it all the time trust me had sr with rod knok and it would get louder as rpm gose up

Soon as I got home I took off the valve cover and the chain looks fine, no slack at all in it, but one thing I noticed when the noise got louder was that at idle the car had almost no oil pressure(0-1psi) but with a light tap of the throttle it went up to normal could just be my aftermarket pressure sender acting up though. I did do an oil change that morning and I didn't notice anything strange like copper shavings, cause like I said I check and change my oil religiously...

I'm going to drain the oil and remove the pan to check the rods later on though.

[heavenboundkevin]

rebuilding a bottom end isnt that hard man. just fyi

[Corbic]

Originally Posted by Dee

Yes, I am aware of how much the parts cost, thanks though. I've been wanting to go back to KA anyway. I'll keep the SR and rebuild it for another project later down the road but as for my Daily driver I'm going back to KA, I'm sick of Cali and the CHP.

Oh and you forgot one crucial part of that list. LABOR because I haven't got a clue on how to rebuild a motor. I can do head gasket, turbo installations, etc but when it comes to the bottom end I know jack.

How are you going to learn if your not willing to try?

Its not hard, just check your clearances (Gauge) and torque (Gauge).

Have you actually been a victim of the CHP or California Regulations/Tickets? Or are you just bitching to bitch?

Old saying - work with what you have, its easier, its cheaper. You have an SR, fix it, make it work. Tell them you swapped it from a SE-R...

[Dee]

Originally Posted by Corbic

How are you going to learn if your not willing to try?

Its not hard, just check your clearances (Gauge) and torque (Gauge).

Have you actually been a victim of the CHP or California Regulations/Tickets? Or are you just bitching to bitch?

Old saying - work with what you have, its easier, its cheaper. You have an SR, fix it, make it work. Tell them you swapped it from a SE-R...

Never said I wasn't willing to learn, I am always willing to learn; everything I have learned thus far has been from my willingness to research and apply theory. My statement was that I am not going to rebuild it for my daily driven 240 because I am sick of getting tickets and getting popped, I have no more free money I want to give away to the state of California so I am taking appropriate and responsible action.

Anyway I have been on the look out for clean coupe that hasn't been ruined that my SR20 would more than likely go into and as for my daily -- I can get KA24DE down the street complete 300 bucks with everything I would need to get me where I need to go while I am waiting to have my SR20 rebuilt, because quite frankly if I'm going to tear the motor apart I want to do everything that would support 400+ hp reliably even if it takes me a year to do it I'd rather do it right the first time.

[herbieS13]

i had a similar problem with my sr b4, have u checked your lifters?

[KaminaSan]

Originally Posted by Dee

Soon as I got home I took off the valve cover and the chain looks fine, no slack at all in it, but one thing I noticed when the noise got louder was that at idle the car had almost no oil pressure(0-1psi) but with a light tap of the throttle it went up to normal could just be my aftermarket pressure sender acting up though. I did do an oil change that morning and I didn't notice anything strange like copper shavings, cause like I said I check and change my oil religiously...

I'm going to drain the oil and remove the pan to check the rods later on though.

That's not your gauge messing up. That's the huge amount of clearance from not having a bearing where it should be allowing oil to spill out which kills all the pressure.

No resistance from the bearing=low oil pressure.

[KaminaSan]

Originally Posted by Corbic

Yeah, cause Bearings are hella expensive.

Rebuild that shit -

Bearings - $100
Gasket Set - $140
Machine Shop -$40
ARP Head Studs - $140
Piston Rings - $100

Brand New Motor instead of haggard KA-T - Priceless

And not to double post, but I'm not quite sure where you are getting your prices.

Bearings-100
Gasket Set 140
Machine Shop- 40?! I think not my man.
He needs to regrind and polish his crank, if it's still useable after driving on it with knock. Don't forget he will need to have his crank balanced too. That alone is another 250+.
New Piston rings means rehoning the cylinder walls, decking the block etc if you are doing it right.

Not cheap.

Oh, and he needs a new rod.

[Corbic]

Originally Posted by KaminaSan

And not to double post, but I'm not quite sure where you are getting your prices.

Bearings-100
Gasket Set 140
Machine Shop- 40?! I think not my man.
He needs to regrind and polish his crank, if it's still useable after driving on it with knock. Don't forget he will need to have his crank balanced too. That alone is another 250+.
New Piston rings means rehoning the cylinder walls, decking the block etc if you are doing it right.

Not cheap.

Oh, and he needs a new rod.

Machine was $140.

No need to "deck" just bore check and honed.

Crank only needs to be balanced if it's machined, inspection is all he needs ATM.

Gasket kits can be had for $140ish, oem head gasket obviously.

Ive seen both OEM and ACL bearing sets go for around $100 for both rod and main.

At the end of the day it will cost $600-1000 depending how much he wants and does too it. However, he'll have a fresh motor with perfect compression and piece of mind.

Then again you can do all the work and cost to rip it out, swap a high-mileage KA, boost it, tune it... and hope it doesn't start to knock...

[StryfeS13]

Dude. If I had rod knock in my engine, I would not just replace the one bearing/rod. Because the clearance is NOT going to be perfect since the rod was banging up the crank. And on top of that, the rod was shaking around, probably letting the piston move around, causing the bore to get all scratched and shit.

There's a chance he may never have full compression in that cylinder again, without getting that thing taken apart, machine work on the cylinders (you should anyway if you rebuild), the crank fixed, a new rod, the rod matched to the crank, etc. And then, he'd have to get a different size bearing for the rod that ate the crank, unless he wants to get every journal machined to the same size. Machine work would not only be $140. I guess it'd be $140 if you didn't really care and just wanted a half-decent motor.

He's gonna spend just as much buying a KA and rebuilding it, as he would taking out the SR and rebuilding it, assuming he goes with forged internals/etc. If he were to go with stock internals...he'd still spend less rebuilding a KA or even buying a running one.

And, KA-T is not haggard. It's haggard if the person who built the KA didn't know what they were doing, or if they have some janky ass turbo set up. If you go KA-T, you build it, period.

[Team DET]

Originally Posted by Corbic

Machine was $140.

No need to "deck" just bore check and honed.

Crank only needs to be balanced if it's machined, inspection is all he needs ATM.

Gasket kits can be had for $140ish, oem head gasket obviously.

Ive seen both OEM and ACL bearing sets go for around $100 for both rod and main.

At the end of the day it will cost $600-1000 depending how much he wants and does too it. However, he'll have a fresh motor with perfect compression and piece of mind.

Then again you can do all the work and cost to rip it out, swap a high-mileage KA, boost it, tune it... and hope it doesn't start to knock...

thanks for the info.It give's me a idea on how much it would cost me to rebuild my botton end.

[Corbic]

Originally Posted by StryfeS13

Dude. If I had rod knock in my engine, I would not just replace the one bearing/rod. Because the clearance is NOT going to be perfect since the rod was banging up the crank. And on top of that, the rod was shaking around, probably letting the piston move around, causing the bore to get all scratched and shit.

You have no idea what you are talking about. Nobody is talking about replacing a single bearing, who the fuck would do that?

Please read a engine building guide or something before spewing miss information. You have been reading to much Import Tuner.

There is no reason to replace the rods, pistons or crank. As I stated, take it to a shop, have it inspected. A bore and hone will with crank inspect will be less then $150 all day long.

ZOMFG GOOGLE

MACHINE SHOP PRICES

Bore Block + Hone = $75
Check Crank = $8


Between myself and group of friends we've rebuilt about a dozen or more engines in the last 3 years.

[UNITEDMASTER]

Yes sir rod knock 100%

[chetos13]

i had the same problem it was the timing chain guide it was broken in half.

[Dee]

Ok so here's the video. no need to pull the pan, just gonna pull the whole motor this weekend.

[imcunner]

sounded exactly like my car, it turned out to be cracked valve springs. it made the exact noise and it was boucing around the retainers

[andiqqqq]

It sounds like piston hit the head. I have the same sound 2 months ago.
5 days ago i got rebuild my engine.
New gasket, new piston rings, new crank, new rod, engine totaly cleaned and set of ACL. After 50km of riding betwen 1krpm to 2,5k rpn i checked the engine and heared knock over 3krpm.
SR shit.

[Om1kron]

LOL @ this thread, a word of advice to any of you guys out there, if you hear shit like the initial video. Stop driving on the motor and inspect it IMMEDIATELY, his crank was still salvagable in that first video.

When you hear knock like in the second video, the bearing is bad enough to where it will start eating the crank and you will have to replace it.

[besTint]

ive had that problem on one of my cars, it was the timing chain guide. older guides were made completely of plastic and tend to snap. the newer ones have a metal lining. i was told it was a pretty common problem with SR's. also need to make sure you have the upper chain guide. the metal L shaped bracket on top of the chain.

[Reese'sSR20]

Hey guys I am new to the forums. I have a black notch top Sr20det there is a slight clicking or knocking coming from what seem to be the exhaust side of the valves over cylinder 1 or 2. The weird thing is that the knocking does not happen all the time it seems to go away at idle on warmer days where the car idles slightly lower. The car has an upgraded garrett turbo running 13PSI. I have taken my valve cover off to see if there was any leaks in oil or a loose bolt. Hoping someone on here can help me figure out this issue Thanks in advance.