brake fade? - Zilvia.net Forums | Nissan 240SX (Silvia) and Z (Fairlady) Car Forum

SilviaSR20DET · 06-30-2008, 02:42 PM

Im using the pbr xbg semi metallic brake pads with q45 calipers and using hawk hps in the rear with stock calipers. When i brake hard at higher speeds it feels as if the brakes fade easily. I bled the system countless times with a speed bleeder. Could the PBR brake pads be causing this? I dont see much people using it so im not sure if its good quality ones.

calico · 06-30-2008, 02:56 PM

the xbg pads are lower in performance compared to the hps pads. i would say the pbr ultimate (axxis ultimate) pads are near the same performance level as hps. the ultimate pads are better than the xbg's when comparing the different models of pbr brake pads

calico · 06-30-2008, 02:58 PM

so... i would say yes, the problem could be the pbr brake pads

sorry, didn't realize i didn't actually answer your question in my previous post

SilviaSR20DET · 06-30-2008, 07:49 PM

thats what i thought, because at lower speeds it brakes pretty good but at higher speeds it loses its braking power. Thanks for the heads up and next time ill stick with all the same brake pads and ditch the pbr's.

norbac · 06-30-2008, 07:58 PM

so axxiss ultimates are good? (sorry for thread jacking)

racepar1 · 06-30-2008, 08:06 PM

That's exactly why I don't wanna do the q-45 front brakes on my car. There are no true race pads available for them. HPS's in the front would be much better and I know a lot of guys that swear by the axis ultimates, but in the end they are both weaksauce for track useage. For street just slap some HPS's or axis ultimates on the front and you'll be good. I personally don't like to run mis-matched front and rear brakes though.

JohnJohn86 · 06-30-2008, 08:08 PM

Get Porterfield pads. No fade for me even in Buttonwillow Raceway

racepar1 · 06-30-2008, 08:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnJohn86

Get Porterfield pads. No fade for me even in Buttonwillow Raceway

Porterfield makes pads for the q-45 calipers? If so I will re-consider putting the q brakes on.

EDIT: I just checked and porterfield only has the r-4s pads, which is their "street" version. Still almost certainly superior to any other pads mentioned in this thread. For all-out track useage I think it would be better to source a set of ABS s-13 calipers and slotted rotors with the porterfield r-4 pads and some brake ducts.

MrChow · 06-30-2008, 08:23 PM

^^^^^
http://www.horsepowerfreaks.com/perf...kes/Brake_Pads

SilviaSR20DET · 06-30-2008, 09:40 PM

i think EBC has race pads for the q45, so it seems like theres quite a bit of selections from what i know so far.

racepar1 · 06-30-2008, 09:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MrChow

^^^^^
http://www.horsepowerfreaks.com/perf...kes/Brake_Pads

NOT race pads!

Quote:

Originally Posted by SilviaSR20DET

i think EBC has race pads for the q45, so it seems like theres quite a bit of selections from what i know so far.

I dunno if I would trust EBC "race" pads.

In either case the porterfield pads would be far superior I believe.

tgd89 · 07-01-2008, 02:46 AM

Exactly what sort of fade are you feeling? A soft mushy pedal, or a hard pedal that doesn't go down? Could be fluid choice, do you have the damper box still hooked up? It could be keeping some air in the system.

0wn3r · 07-01-2008, 07:56 AM

yea what fluid?

JohnJohn86 · 07-01-2008, 09:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by racepar1

Porterfield makes pads for the q-45 calipers? If so I will re-consider putting the q brakes on.

EDIT: I just checked and porterfield only has the r-4s pads, which is their "street" version. Still almost certainly superior to any other pads mentioned in this thread. For all-out track useage I think it would be better to source a set of ABS s-13 calipers and slotted rotors with the porterfield r-4 pads and some brake ducts.

Their street version is more than enough for a N/A KA engine or stock Sr20 IMO. I never had fade no matter how hard I brake.

You can call up portfield and order their race compond. It shouldn't cost that much more.

boozels · 07-01-2008, 10:16 AM

porterfield's are the shit
R4-S are great for the street and can handle any track day anytime!!
you can't go wrong with porterfileds

SilviaSR20DET · 07-01-2008, 01:31 PM

Feels a bit soft mushy when it starts to feel like its fading. Im using valvoline synthetic brake fluid. I didn't delete the dampner box, where is it located? But it locks up fine at lower speeds, just that the higher the speed and braking hard, i feel fade.

SilviaSR20DET · 07-01-2008, 01:33 PM

Oh and i forgot to mention that my BMC was leaking in the past and the brakes prior to the q45 conversion had the fading problem.

aznrib · 07-01-2008, 01:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by racepar1

That's exactly why I don't wanna do the q-45 front brakes on my car. There are no true race pads available for them. HPS's in the front would be much better and I know a lot of guys that swear by the axis ultimates, but in the end they are both weaksauce for track useage. For street just slap some HPS's or axis ultimates on the front and you'll be good. I personally don't like to run mis-matched front and rear brakes though.

I bought my q45s from frsport with r4s pads and r4 pads made by porterfield. No fade so far.

racepar1 · 07-01-2008, 04:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SilviaSR20DET

Feels a bit soft mushy when it starts to feel like its fading. Im using valvoline synthetic brake fluid. I didn't delete the dampner box, where is it located? But it locks up fine at lower speeds, just that the higher the speed and braking hard, i feel fade.

Try different fluid too. On a buget I like the castrol GT LMA fluid. We used it on our formula atlantic cars for YEARS without problems. There is no dampener in the brake system, just in the clutch system. The guy who gave you that info in this tread was smoking some shit!

SilviaSR20DET · 07-01-2008, 11:35 PM

okay ill give that fluid a try and new brake pads when these wear off. I was about to say that there is no dampener box because the only one i remember taking off is my clutch dampener haha!

McCoy · 07-02-2008, 06:49 AM

When was the last time you bled your brakes? I've been using the Valvoline SynPower for 5 years now and have yet had fluid boil while on track... and the track I run on is one that is not easy on brakes.

SilviaSR20DET · 07-02-2008, 12:18 PM

i bled it like 2 months ago when i changed my stock front brakes to the q45 brake calipers. Do you guys think its my bmc? Or possibly a faulty rear caliper because i had a hard time turning the piston back in and the rubber cover is stuck.

steve shadows · 07-02-2008, 01:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnJohn86

Get Porterfield pads. No fade for me even in Buttonwillow Raceway

Yeah Im trashing my Hawks and going BACK TO porterfields soon

06-30-2008, 02:42 PM	#1
SilviaSR20DET Zilvia FREAK! Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Seattle, WA Posts: 1,221 Trader Rating: (9) Feedback Score: 9 reviews	brake fade? Im using the pbr xbg semi metallic brake pads with q45 calipers and using hawk hps in the rear with stock calipers. When i brake hard at higher speeds it feels as if the brakes fade easily. I bled the system countless times with a speed bleeder. Could the PBR brake pads be causing this? I dont see much people using it so im not sure if its good quality ones.

07-01-2008, 07:56 AM	#13
0wn3r Zilvia Addict Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: CT Posts: 676 Trader Rating: (4) Feedback Score: 4 reviews	yea what fluid? __________________ 97 240sx se

07-01-2008, 10:16 AM	#15
boozels Zilvia Addict Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: So Cali Posts: 614 Trader Rating: (3) Feedback Score: 3 reviews	porterfield's are the shit R4-S are great for the street and can handle any track day anytime!! you can't go wrong with porterfileds __________________ t-apc.com t-apc.com t-apc.com t-apc.com

06-30-2008, 02:56 PM	#2
calico Leaky Injector Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: TN Posts: 64 Trader Rating: (4) Feedback Score: 4 reviews	the xbg pads are lower in performance compared to the hps pads. i would say the pbr ultimate (axxis ultimate) pads are near the same performance level as hps. the ultimate pads are better than the xbg's when comparing the different models of pbr brake pads

06-30-2008, 02:58 PM	#3
calico Leaky Injector Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: TN Posts: 64 Trader Rating: (4) Feedback Score: 4 reviews	so... i would say yes, the problem could be the pbr brake pads sorry, didn't realize i didn't actually answer your question in my previous post

06-30-2008, 07:49 PM	#4
SilviaSR20DET Zilvia FREAK! Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Seattle, WA Posts: 1,221 Trader Rating: (9) Feedback Score: 9 reviews	thats what i thought, because at lower speeds it brakes pretty good but at higher speeds it loses its braking power. Thanks for the heads up and next time ill stick with all the same brake pads and ditch the pbr's.

06-30-2008, 07:58 PM	#5
norbac Zilvia Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: a nice place Posts: 165 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	so axxiss ultimates are good? (sorry for thread jacking)

06-30-2008, 08:06 PM	#6
racepar1 Post Whore! Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Simi Valley, CA Age: 42 Posts: 9,006 Trader Rating: (106) Rides Gallery: racepar1 Feedback Score: 106 reviews	That's exactly why I don't wanna do the q-45 front brakes on my car. There are no true race pads available for them. HPS's in the front would be much better and I know a lot of guys that swear by the axis ultimates, but in the end they are both weaksauce for track useage. For street just slap some HPS's or axis ultimates on the front and you'll be good. I personally don't like to run mis-matched front and rear brakes though.

06-30-2008, 08:08 PM	#7
JohnJohn86 Zilvia Junkie Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: West Covina CA Posts: 383 Trader Rating: (1) Feedback Score: 1 reviews	Get Porterfield pads. No fade for me even in Buttonwillow Raceway

06-30-2008, 09:40 PM	#10
SilviaSR20DET Zilvia FREAK! Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Seattle, WA Posts: 1,221 Trader Rating: (9) Feedback Score: 9 reviews	i think EBC has race pads for the q45, so it seems like theres quite a bit of selections from what i know so far.

07-01-2008, 02:46 AM	#12
tgd89 Leaky Injector Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: abq nm Posts: 123 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	Exactly what sort of fade are you feeling? A soft mushy pedal, or a hard pedal that doesn't go down? Could be fluid choice, do you have the damper box still hooked up? It could be keeping some air in the system.

07-01-2008, 01:31 PM	#16
SilviaSR20DET Zilvia FREAK! Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Seattle, WA Posts: 1,221 Trader Rating: (9) Feedback Score: 9 reviews	Feels a bit soft mushy when it starts to feel like its fading. Im using valvoline synthetic brake fluid. I didn't delete the dampner box, where is it located? But it locks up fine at lower speeds, just that the higher the speed and braking hard, i feel fade.

07-01-2008, 01:33 PM	#17
SilviaSR20DET Zilvia FREAK! Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Seattle, WA Posts: 1,221 Trader Rating: (9) Feedback Score: 9 reviews	Oh and i forgot to mention that my BMC was leaking in the past and the brakes prior to the q45 conversion had the fading problem.

07-01-2008, 11:35 PM	#20
SilviaSR20DET Zilvia FREAK! Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Seattle, WA Posts: 1,221 Trader Rating: (9) Feedback Score: 9 reviews	okay ill give that fluid a try and new brake pads when these wear off. I was about to say that there is no dampener box because the only one i remember taking off is my clutch dampener haha!

07-02-2008, 06:49 AM	#21
McCoy Zilvia Junkie Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: WA Age: 49 Posts: 317 Trader Rating: (5) Feedback Score: 5 reviews	When was the last time you bled your brakes? I've been using the Valvoline SynPower for 5 years now and have yet had fluid boil while on track... and the track I run on is one that is not easy on brakes.

07-02-2008, 12:18 PM	#22
SilviaSR20DET Zilvia FREAK! Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Seattle, WA Posts: 1,221 Trader Rating: (9) Feedback Score: 9 reviews	i bled it like 2 months ago when i changed my stock front brakes to the q45 brake calipers. Do you guys think its my bmc? Or possibly a faulty rear caliper because i had a hard time turning the piston back in and the rubber cover is stuck.